721106 - Lecture NOD - Vrndavana

Lectures by Date, 1972

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

721106ND-VRNDAVAN - November 06, 1972 - 43:06 Minutes

Pradyumna: (reading) ". . . in full Kṛṣṇa consciousness, how is it possible that he has not become purified? It is not possible. (break)

"One who is engaged in Kṛṣṇa consciousness and devotional service has, without doubt, become freed from all contaminations of material sinful activities. Devotional service therefore has the power to actually nullify all kinds of reactions to sinful deeds. A devotee is nevertheless always alert not to commit any sinful activities; this is his specific qualification as a devotee. Thus the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam states that by performing devotional service a person who was born even in a family of dog-eaters may become eligible to take part in the performance of the ritualistic ceremonies recommended in the Vedas."

"It is implicit in this statement that a person born into a family of dog-eaters is generally not fit for performing yajña, or sacrifice. The priestly caste in charge of performing these ritualistic sacrifices, ritualistic ceremonies recommended in the Vedas, is called the brāhmin order. Unless one is a brāhmin, he cannot perform these ceremonies. A person is born in a brāhmin family or in a family of dog-eaters due to his past activities. If a person is born in a family of dog-eaters, it means that his past activities are all sinful. But even . . . if even such a person takes to the path of devotional service and begins to chant the holy names of the Lord—Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare/ Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare—he is at once fit to perform the ritualistic ceremonies. This means that his sinful reactions have immediately become neutralized."

Prabhupāda: Śvādo 'pi sadyaḥ savanāya kalpate (SB 3.33.6). It is commented by Śrīla Jīva Gosvāmī that a . . . a person born in the brāhmin family waits for being initiated as twice-born. To take birth in the family of a brāhmin is not sufficient qualification. He has to study the Vedas; he has to be initiated with thread ceremony; so many ritualistic performances. Daśa-vidhā-saṁskāra. Saṁskārād bhaved dvijaḥ (Skanda Purāṇa). So the distinction is being made by Jīva Gosvāmī that a brāhmin, son of a brāhmin, awaits so many ritualistic ceremonies before he is competent to perform yajña. Not that because he's born of a brāhmin father, therefore he becomes eligible to perform yajña. He requires primarily so much purificatory methods.

But a Vaiṣṇava, one who has taken to devotional service, for him it is said, sadyaḥ savanāya kalpate. As soon as he becomes a devotee, he becomes eligible to perform yajña. Savanāya kalpate. That means preference is given to the devotee than to the son of a brāhmin. A devotee, although born in the family of dog-eaters, the lowest of the mankind, but if he's Vaiṣṇava, initiated, dīkṣā-vidhānena (break) . . . then he becomes eligible to perform sacrifice. That is officially accepted, that a Vaiṣṇava, even born of dog-eaters' family . . . kirāta-hūṇāndhra-pulinda-pulkaśā ābhīra-śumbhā yavanāḥ khasādayaḥ, ye'nye ca pāpā (SB 2.4.18). These are the list of low-grade human society, kirāta-hūṇāndhra. And there may be others also. Isko thoda pani pilao. (Please give him some water.) There may be others. Ye 'nye ca pāpā. Anye—any kinds of sinful man, śudhyanti yad-upāśrayāśrayāḥ, if such men take shelter of a pure devotee, then he purifies him. Śudhyanti.

One may question how he becomes purified. He's born of a family of dog-eaters. How he becomes purified? It requires . . . according to smārta consideration, he requires next birth. There are two processes of Vedic understanding, Smārta-vicāra and Gosvāmī-vicāra. According to Smārta-vicāra, unless a person born in a low-grade family takes another birth, he cannot be eligible to become a brāhmin. But according to Gosvāmī-vicāra, if he's properly initiated by a bona fide Vaiṣṇava, then he becomes more than a brāhmin. Śvādyo 'pi sadyaḥ. Immediately he becomes eligible to perform sacrifices.

So the problem is that at the present moment we are not taking care . . . I mean that our Indian brāhmins, those who are spiritual leaders, they are not actually taking care of the fallen souls. But in the Bhagavad-gītā it is sanctioned, it is said clearly: māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ (BG 9.32). Any person born of low-grade family, pāpa-yoni, striyo vaiśyās tathā śūdrās te 'pi yānti parāṁ gatim . . . so it is the duty of the elevated person, brāhmins and Vaiṣṇavas, to take charge of this business. Kṛṣṇa says, ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ. Never mind one is born in low-grade family, but he can go back to home, back to Godhead. Te 'pi yānti parāṁ gatim.

So who will take the initiative to elevate these persons? Unless one who is expert does not take interest for elevating these fallen souls, then how they will be elevated? This is problem. But we are not careful about these affair. Caitanya Mahāprabhu therefore indicated that:

bhārata-bhūmite manuṣya janma haila yāra

janma sārthaka kari' kara paropakāra

(CC Adi 9.41)

This is paropakāra. Those who are born in low-grade family . . .

The most regrettable fact is that in India the brāhmins and Vaiṣṇavas, they did not take care of the fallen souls. Once one becomes, somehow or other, a Muhammadan, he has no more chance to come back to the Hindu society. This policy was being followed. And therefore the result is that these fallen souls, whom we call fallen souls, the Muhammadans, they partitioned. Now we are crying.

Not only that. I think, from historical point of view, this whole planet was India, Bhārata-varṣa. This planet was called Bhārata-varṣa—not this portion of land. But because gradually the Vedic culture become diminished, they separated from this Vedic culture, as we have got actual experience, and within twenty years the Pakistan is taken away from India.

So if we follow that policy that one who is born in India as brāhmin, except him, nobody can become brāhmin, then this Vedic civilization will be, in due course of time, lost. We should be very careful. Therefore this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is spreading Vedic culture outside India, and they are welcoming it, those who are intelligent, they are welcoming it. They are accepting it. We should encourage them. Instead of discouraging this movement, we should encourage, so that the whole world can be united on the platform of this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. If we simply hate low-grade families, low-grade men, that will not solve the problem.

Just like when there was political movement in India, the Britishers, they presented so many problems—just like the untouchables, the Muhammadans and so many things. The Britishers, they put forward these problems they were not willing to separate the British rule. Only some high class, higher section of the Hindu, they are trying to separate the British rule. At that time, Gandhi stamped the chamars and the bhaṅgis as harijana. But means as soon as there was the word "harijana," immediately a person would be considered coming from the chamars and the bhaṅgis.

But such exalted title, harijana, is offered to personalities like Nārada, Brahmā, those who are actually associates with Hari. But according to śāstra, there is no objection to accept these chamars and the bhaṅgis or any low-grade family to make him harijana, provided he accepts the lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa in a regular way, by the Vaiṣṇava vidhāna.

Just recommended by the Gosvāmīs, Sanātana Gosvāmī: tathā dīkṣā-vidhānena dvijatvaṁ jāyate nṛṇām. Dīkṣā-vidhānena, by the proper initiative process, one can become dvija, twice-born. Nṛṇām. Tathā, yathā kāñ . . .

yathā kāñcanatāṁ yāti

kāṁsyaṁ rasa-vidhānena

tathā dīkṣā-vidhānena

dvijatvaṁ jāyate nṛṇām

(Hari-bhakti-vilāsa 2.12)

This is the injunction of Sanātana Gosvāmī. Just like by chemical manipulation, by mercury, with kāṁsya, bell metal . . . this is the suggestion given by Sanātana Gosvāmī, that as bell metal can be transformed into gold by mixing with mercury, similarly—it is a question of manipulating—similarly, by expert manipulation, even a . . . any man, not low or high, it doesn't matter, any man can be transformed into a brāhmin, dvija, twice-born.

So this is recommended not only by Sanātana Gosvāmī, by Kṛṣṇa in the Bhagavad-gītā and Śukadeva Gosvāmī in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Śudhyanti prabha viṣṇave namaḥ. He recommends that one, when one becomes a Vaiṣṇava by the supreme power of Viṣṇu, prabha viṣṇave namaḥ, He has got so much power that He can turn a low-grade man into a great Vaiṣṇava.

Just like Haridāsa Ṭhākura. Haridāsa Ṭhākura, he was born in Muhammadan family, and he was made Nāmācārya Haridāsa Ṭhākura by Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Nāmācārya, "the ācārya . . ." Caitanya Mahāprabhu actually appeared for glorifying the holy name of the Lord. Harer nāma harer nāma harer nāma iva kevalam (CC Adi 17.21). Kṛṣṇa-varṇaṁ tviṣākṛṣṇam (SB 11.5.32), always chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. So Caitanya Mahāprabhu especially incarnated, advented Himself for spreading this Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra, and Haridāsa Ṭhākura, who was born in a Muhammadan family, he, he was made the namācārya, the authority of spreading this holy name.

Similarly, Sanātana Gosvāmī, they become Muhammadans. At least, formerly. His name was also changed—Sākara Mallika, Dabira Khāsa. And they were made the prime ministers of spreading this saṅkīrtana movement, the Caitanya cult, Sanātana . . . we are sitting here (in) Rūpa Gosvāmī's place. So officially, they become Muhammadan, but by the grace of Caitanya Mahāprabhu, they became Gosvāmī, Rūpa Gosvāmī. Ei chay gosāñi tāhra mui dāsa. Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura says that, "These six Gosvāmīs, anyone who accepts these six Gosvāmīs as authority, spiritual masters, I am his servant." Therefore we Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇava, we are known as Rūpānuga Vaiṣṇava, following the footsteps of Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī.

So this is the process. So by following the footsteps of Rūpa Gosvāmī, the whole world become . . . can become purified. Śvādo 'pi sadyaḥ sayanāya kalpate. Not only purified, but they are purified so much so that they can be allowed to perform yajñas. Because performing yajña was entrusted to high-class brāhmin who is very expert in mantra-tantra-viśāradaḥ, not ordinary brāhmin. So a Vaiṣṇava is recommended to take charge of performing sacrifices. Śvādo'pi sadyaḥ savanāya kalpate.

So this is the exalted position. Haridāsa Ṭhākura . . . actually, this was exemplified by Gadādhara . . . yes, Advaita Prabhu. Advaita Prabhu happened to be at that time the president of the brāhmin society, very learned scholar and Vaiṣṇava; and He was entrusted to be the president of brāhmin society in Śāntipūra. So when He performed the ritualistic ceremony after the death of His father, funeral ceremony, He offered the first prasādam to Haridāsa Ṭhākura.

So Haridāsa Ṭhākura was little shy accepting that, "Advaita Prabhu, You have exalted me in so many ways, but You . . ." Because according to the smārta-vidhāna, when one is performing the funeral ceremony of his father, the first portion would be offered to the best of the brāhmins. So it was offered to Haridāsa Ṭhākura. So Haridāsa Ṭhākura felt little shyness that, "Advaita Prabhu, You love me. That is all right. But You are doing all these things. You may be socially ostracized." So Advaita Prabhu said: "No. By feeding you, I am feeding one crores of best brāhmins. And let any brāhmin come to Me, I shall convince him." That was His statement.

So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is so nice that we can accept anyone—it doesn't matter wherefrom he's coming—and make him a pure Vaiṣṇava. And following the footsteps of Advaita Prabhu, Caitanya Mahāprabhu, these Vaiṣṇavas from foreign countries, those who are actually purified by the process of initiation, they should be accepted. They should not be neglected.

Unfortunately, there is some silent protest that I am ruining the Hindu religion because I am initiating the Europeans and Americans. Therefore I am ruining Hindu religion. There is a grudge against me. But you can just consider these points that I am going strictly according to the regulation given by the Gosvāmīs and the śāstras. Śāstra allows. Kṛṣṇa says, māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ (BG 9.32). Pāpa-yoni, any pāpa-yoni, it doesn't matter, if he takes regularly the shelter of Kṛṣṇa, lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa . . . and Caitanya Mahāprabhu ordered that:

pṛthivīte āche yata nagarādi grāma

sarvatra pracāra haibe mora nāma

(CB Antya-khaṇḍa 4.126)

He predicted. Practically we are trying to carry out the order of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Caitanya Mahāprabhu ordered that anyone who has taken birth as human being in Bhārata-varṣa, he should engage his life for paropakāra. And He said also, pṛthivīte āche yata nagarādi grāma: "All over the town . . . all over the world, as many towns and villages are there, My name will be established there."

So we are trying to do that. So His name should be established does not mean that they should remain as yavanas or mlecchas, and simply they should simply know Lord Caitanya. No. Actually the fact is that everyone should be elevated to the position of Vaiṣṇava, purified Vaiṣṇava, as it is recommended in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavata, Bhagavad-gītā. Cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). They . . . they should be made into brāhmins by qualifying them as brāhmin.

So the first condition is that anyone who comes to Kṛṣṇa consciousness as a bona fide initiated member, he gives up all these abominable habits: no illicit sex, no meat-eating, no gambling, no intoxication. They have given up even smoking cigarette, even drinking tea, coffee. So they are all, after being qualified, they are accepted as Vaiṣṇava and properly initiated.

So they cannot be neglected as other than brāhmins. That is not very good proposition. They are, according to śāstra, they are qualified. It may be due to some past habits they may commit some mistake, unconsciously. Consciously, no Vaiṣṇava commits any mistake, but may be due to habit. That is also protected by Kṛṣṇa. Api cet su-durācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). Even there are some discrepancies, but if the only one qualification is there, that he's sticking to Kṛṣṇa consciousness rigidly, he's sādhu. Sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ. He's not to be neglected.

So these Europeans, Americans devotees, according to the enunciation given by Rūpa Gosvāmī, as it is supported by Lord Kṛṣṇa Himself, as it is supported by Śukadeva Gosvāmī, as it is supported by Sanātana Gosvāmī, as it is ordered by Caitanya Mahāprabhu, they are regularly initiated Vaiṣṇava. They should not be neglected. That will be vaiṣṇava-aparādha, offenses unto the Vaiṣṇava. Out of all kinds of aparādhas, offenses, vaiṣṇava-aparādha is the most dangerous. Most dangerous.

So vaiṣṇava-aparādha is not excused by Viṣṇu. The instance is . . . what is called? Su . . . I forget his name. Ambarīṣa and . . .?

Devotee: Durvāsā?

Prabhupāda: Durvāsā. (chuckles) Yes, Durvāsā Muni. Durvāsā Muni, because he offended to Ambarīṣa Mahārāja, he was not excused even by Viṣṇu. He had to fall down on the feet of Mahārāja Ambarīṣa. Yes. Ambarīṣa upākhyāna. Yes.

So vaiṣṇava-aparādha is the greatest offense. Even a great sage like Durvāsā was not excused. He was so great, Durvāsā, that he could go personally to all the lokas—Brahmā-loka, Śiva-loka, Viṣṇu-loka. Personally he could go, by his yogic power. Just imagine how much he was powerful. He saw face-to-face Lord Viṣṇu and requested Him to give him protection from the sudarśana-cakra, and Viṣṇu refused, "So I cannot give you protection, because you are offender to a Vaiṣṇava. Only Ambarīṣa Mahārāja can give you protection." Just see. He was so exalted yogī that he could see personally Lord Brahmā, Lord Śiva, Lord Viṣṇu, but still, he was not excused on account of his offense to a Vaiṣṇava.

Caitanya Mahāprabhu has warned very severely: tāra madhye vaiṣṇava aparādha hātī matta. Vaiṣṇava-aparādha is the greatest offense. We should be very careful. In . . . according to our Vedic civilization, a Vaiṣṇava, a saintly person, was never under the government laws. They, they were not under the govern . . . why government laws? Even Yamarāja's law. That is also stated. Yamarāja also warned his servants not to approach Vaiṣṇava. So Vaiṣṇava's position is so great.

So this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is meant for turning everyone to become a pure Vaiṣṇava. Pure Vaiṣṇava. That is the actual aim of human life. As we were discussing this morning, mumukṣavaḥ. The aim of human life is to get out of the clutches of māyā, repetition of birth and death and transmigration from one body to another. That is the real aim of life. That is real freedom.

So if we neglect this opportunity, then we are called ātma-hā. Ātma-hā means committing suicide. Just like a person knowingly, knowingly committing suicide, cutting his throat—similarly, a human being, getting so much opportunity, especially in India . . . we have got so many books of knowledge, especially the Bhagavad-gītā, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Vedānta-sūtra. Vedānta-sūtra means Śrīmad-Bhāgavata. Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is explicit narration of the Vedānta-sūtra. Bhāṣyaṁ brahma-sūtrānām.

So Indians especially should take advantage of this human form of life and spread this knowledge all over the world. Then the whole world will be peaceful and happy. That is our proposition. It is not a . . . I repeatedly say that this is not a religious cult, that we want to supersede another type of religion. That is not our business. Our aim is to make all people happy. Sarve sukhino bhavantu. This is the Vedic mission. Everyone should be happy.

But they are trying to be happy, but they do not know how to be, become. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). They are misguided. They cannot be happy without becoming Vaiṣṇava. This is open declaration in the śāstra. They cannot become happy. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ durāśayā (SB 7.5.31). If they are trying to become happy otherwise, that is durāśayā, hopeless thing. It will never be fructified. It will never be successful. Na te viduḥ. They do not know. Therefore our business is to make them know that, "This is the way of perfection. Take Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Make your life perfect. Be happy, and go back to home, back to Godhead." This is our mission. They do not know.

So we are trying to convince them in so many ways. There is no need of so many ways. The one, simple method, chanting of Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, will be sufficient to make them perfect. Ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanaṁ bhava-mahā-dāvāgni-nirvāpaṇam (CC Antya 20.12). The problems, bhava-mahā-dāvāgni. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, mahā-dāvāgni, "great forest fire." Forest fire, we have no experience immediately, but in America there is occasionally forest fire. They have got very good experience. There are many forests also. So the forest fire takes place automatically. Nobody goes to set fire.

Similarly, in this material world the blazing fire is always there—problems, different problems. Bhava-mahā-dāvāgni-nirvāpaṇam. This will be extinguished immediately. It is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's saying. How? Paraṁ vijayate śrī-kṛṣṇa-saṅkīrtanam. Simply by spreading this saṅkīrtana movement, all the problems of the world will be immediately mitigated.

So to make people Vaiṣṇava, pure Vaiṣṇava, and to spread the saṅkīrtana movement, this is the mission of Caitanya Mahāprabhu, and we are trying our best. Actually, it was the duty of the Indians, but fortunately, the Americans have taken up instead of Indians. Therefore I have brought them. The Indians . . . you are forgetting your duty. The foreigners are doing your duty. So you should welcome them, instead of driving them away by so many pleas. This is not very good.

Yes. Go on.

Pradyumna: "It is stated in the Padma Purāṇa that there are four kinds of effects due to sinful activities, which are listed as follows: (1) the effect which is not yet fructified, (2) the effect which is lying as seed, (3) the effect which is already mature and (4) the effect which is almost mature. It is also stated that all these four effects . . ."

Prabhupāda: Kūṭa-stha-bīja, prārabdha . . . like that. This is . . . these are the . . . our effects. Just like we can understand in the modern . . . just like if you infect some disease, it becomes immediately kūṭa-stha. Kūṭa-stha means stocked. In due course of time, it will come out, manifest. Similarly, we are acting so many sinful activities. Sometimes they complain that, "This man is committing so many sinful activities, but he's happy."

But actually he's enjoying the effects of his past something pious. Now he's happy. But that effect of the impious activities, that is in stock. It will come out in due course of time. That is called kūṭa-stha. Kūṭa-stha phalonmukha, prārabdha. These are the Sanskrit language. That is being explained here.

Go on.

Pradyumna: "It is also stated that all these four effects become immediately vanquished for those who surrender unto the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Viṣṇu, and become engaged in His devotional service in full Kṛṣṇa consciousness."

Prabhupāda: Yes. This, these four kinds of stages of sinful activities—in stock, almost fructified, manifest—all the stages of sinful activities can be immediately nullified. Because it is assured by Kṛṣṇa, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi. It is not imagination. If we believe in the words of Kṛṣṇa, then there is no question of denying this fact.

Kṛṣṇa personally says, ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣa . . . sarva-pāpebhyo (BG 18.66). The kūṭa-stha, phalonmukha, prārabdha, everything, it become immediately nullified, simply by this process, by surrendering: "Kṛṣṇa, I . . . I was mistaken. I got . . . forgot Your mastership, You are my eternal Lord. So I was bewildered. I was wandering. Now I have come to my senses. I surrender unto You sincerely. You accept me." This very thing will give you immediately protection from all sinful activities. Kṛṣṇa says:

sarva-dharmān parityajya

mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja

ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo

mokṣayiṣyāmi . . .

(BG 18.66)

So where is the difficulty? Let us surrender to Kṛṣṇa and execute His will, whatever He . . . surrender means I must be prepared to execute the will of Kṛṣṇa; not my whims, but Kṛṣṇa's will. The Kṛṣṇa's will is that you become Kṛṣṇa's devotee. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). Where is the difficulty? You surrender unto Him, and He assures, mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te (BG 7.14). Immediately he becomes relieved from the effects of illusory energy.

So there is no difficulty, not at all difficulty. Let us immediately become surrendered to Kṛṣṇa's lotus feet, think of Him always. Man-manā bhava mad-bhaktaḥ: to become His devotee, always think of Him. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru. "Always worship Me. Always offer obeisances." These are the four principles. Anyone can do it. There is no restriction for any caste, creed, nation. Everyone. It is open to the human being. So if we actually want to be happy, we must take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. There is no alternative. That is our point.

Yes? Go on.

Pradyumna: "Those effects described as 'almost mature' refer to the distress from which one is suffering at present, and the effects 'lying as seed' means that in the core of the heart there is a certain stock of sinful desires which are like seeds. The Sanskrit word kūṭam means that they are almost ready to produce the seed, or the effect of the seed. And 'immature effect' refers to the case where the seedling has not begun."

"From this statement of Padma Purāṇa it is understood that material contamination is very subtle. Its beginning, its fruition and results, and how one suffers such results in the form of distress, are part of a great chain. When one catches some disease, it is very . . . it is often very difficult to ascertain the cause of the disease, where it originated and how it is maturing."

"The suffering of a disease, however, does not appear all of a sudden. It actually takes time. And as in the medical field, for precaution's sake the doctor injects a vaccination to prevent the growing of contamination, similarly, the practical injection to stop all the fructifications of the seeds of our sinful activities is simply engagement in Kṛṣṇa consciousness."

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa consciousness. This is the best injection. Take this injection and become free from all sinful reaction.

Go on.

Pradyumna: "In this connection, Śukadeva Gosvāmī speaks in the Sixth Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Second Chapter, 17th verse (SB 6.2.17), about the story of Ajāmila, who began life as a fine and dutiful brāhmin but in his young manhood became wholly corrupted by a prostitute. At the end of his wicked life, just by calling the name of Nārāyaṇa (or Kṛṣṇa), he was saved, despite so much sin. Śukadeva points out that austerity . . ."

Prabhupāda: Svalpam apy asya dharmasya trāyate mahato bhayāt (BG 2.40). That is stated the Bhagavad-gītā. Svalpam apy asya dharmasya. A little Kṛṣṇa consciousness can save you from the greatest danger. The example is this Ajāmila. Ajāmila, he was the greatest sinful man. Similarly, Jagāi-Mādhāi. So Kṛṣṇa consciousness is so nice that from the life of Ajāmila we understand, simply by uttering the name of Nārāyaṇa at the time of his death, he became eligible to be promoted to the Vaikuṇṭhaloka.

Go on.

Pradyumna: "Śukadeva points out that austerity, charity and the performance of ritualistic ceremonies for counteracting sinful activities are recommended processes, but that by performing them one cannot remove the sinful desire-seed from the heart, as was the case with Ajāmila in his youth. This sinful desire-seed can be removed only by achieving Kṛṣṇa consciousness, and this can be accomplished very easily by chanting the mahā-mantra, or the Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, as recommended by Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. In other words, unless one adopts the path of devotional service, he cannot be one hundred percent clean from all the reactions of sinful activities."

Prabhupāda: Hmm. So we shall discuss more tomorrow. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) (end)