770509 - Conversation - Hrishikesh
(Redirected from Evening Darsana -- May 9, 1977, Hrishikesh)
Indian man (1): (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: The thing is that we have to . . . Shall I speak in Hindi or in English? There are others . . .
Indian man (1): Most of us, we can follow in English. You speak in English, we can follow.
Prabhupāda: So we are trying to imitate the Western way of life, but it is not possible for us to do that. Our constitution is different, spiritual, and their is material. Now they should be combined. Our government, our people, they want Western way of life, say motorcar. So they can purchase motorcar from foreign countries. What is the wrong there? Why we should waste our energy for manufacturing? Similarly, India should produce agricultural products. They want . . . Just like England: there is no food, food grain. They have . . . Everything they have to import. Even vegetables, daily vegetables, they have to import. So United Nation on the basis of spiritual understanding. Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1). Actually, everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa, or God, and we are His sons. Kṛṣṇa never claimed that "Indians are My sons." Kṛṣṇa said, sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya (BG 14.4): "In every form of life the living entity, their mother is this material nature, and I am the seed-giving father." So on that basis the civilization should be established, and the instruction of Kṛṣṇa should be followed by everyone, and they will be happy. That is the only way. Otherwise they'll suffer continually. They are suffering, and they will continue. (aside:) They have come to disturb.
So that philosophy, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, we are trying to distribute all over the world, and they are accepting. This is the first time in the history of the world that foreigners, they are becoming devotees of Kṛṣṇa. Now, in the history of the world there was no temple outside India, neither devotee also.
Indian man (1): The entire credit goes to you, sir.
Prabhupāda: (chuckles) Yes. From historical reference it is so, but it can go still farther, and in that way India's glories will be magnified. But unfortunately, our leaders and government are callous. They do not know what is India's glory and how India's glory can be distributed. They are trying that India's glory will be magnified by imitating Western way of life. This is the defect. They can understand that the Western way of life has not given them actual happiness. Otherwise why these boys, they are coming to India? They are young boys, and they are coming from very respectable family, rich family, rich nation. They have no economic problem. They have not come here to earn their livelihood, as we go to England to learn something, technology, and earn our livelihood. They have not come here for that purpose. They have enough food, enough everything, material. They are hankering after some spiritual . . .
So there are two sides. (aside:) Why you are reducing? So our leaders, rather, they are misinterpreting śāstra, our leaders, and trying to mold it to the material way of life. This is the pity of the things. Now you should reform them in this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, and real United Nations will be formed. There will be no question of nationality. In the Bhagavad-gītā . . . Big, big leaders, they are reading Bhagavad-gītā, but is there any word as "nationalism"?
Indian man (1): None.
Prabhupāda: And big, big leaders, they are utilizing Bhagavad-gītā for so-called nationalism. Why? There is not a single word as "nationalism." As Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya (BG 14.4). Where is nationalism? There is no question of nationalism. So the difficulty is they do not understand even a line of Bhagavad-gītā, and still, the so-called scholars, philosophers, politicians, they are advertising that "I am student." They do not understand even a line of. This is my challenge. What do you think? They do not understand. Even Gandhi did not understand, not a single line.
Indian man (1): Gandhi did believe in trusteeship theory.
Indian man (1): Gandhijī believed in trusteeship theory of Īśopaniṣad.
Prabhupāda: Trusteeship . . . Trustee . . . Who will be trustee? Who is trustworthy? All thieves and rogues? Who is trustworthy? Trustee is Kṛṣṇa.
Indian man (1): Or He's the owner.
Prabhupāda: Yes. So He's the owner, and if you follow Kṛṣṇa, then you become trustee. You do not follow Kṛṣṇa; you are unworthy of trusteeship. You interpret in a different way Kṛṣṇa. Even sometimes you say that "Kṛṣṇa is fictitious." Do you not do? Don't you say like that?
Indian man (1): No, not . . .
Indian man (2): Very passing reference he made once.
Prabhupāda: Why? That means he does not know what is Kṛṣṇa.
Indian man (3): Who made this reference? Who made this passing reference, where Kṛṣṇa is fictitious?
Indian man (2): Gandhi made . . .
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Gandhijī.
Indian man (2): (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: I don't speak especially of Gandhi, but there are so many. Everyone takes Bhagavad-gītā and misinterprets in his way. Why? Boliye. Why they should misinterpret Bhagavad-gītā? What right they have got?
Indian man: (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ sa kāleneha yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa (BG 4.2). (Hindi) So paramparā, in the paramparā system, the system remains in order. And that is our way of life. Our . . . We are in India. These men have come newly under Western education, but we have got paramparā system, just like Rāmānuja's paramparā, Madhvācārya's paramparā, Viṣṇu Svāmī paramparā. Still there is. Śrī-sampradāya, Madhva-sampradāya, Viṣṇu Svāmī . . .
Indian man (1): Disciplic succession.
Prabhupāda: Succession, yes. So Kṛṣṇa said that the real truth is in the paramparā system. You cannot take anything and misinterpret. Then it is lost. Suppose from the very beginning of my life I have been taught by my father that this is called Dictaphone. Now, if I misinterpret in a different way, then it is lost. "Call a spade a spade." And Kṛṣṇa very distinctly says that "Because that paramparā system is now lost, I am again speaking to you." Purātana. Find out this word, purātana. Mayā te 'dya yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. Why He is speaking purātana, not new definition? Boliye.
Devotee (1): Should I read, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
- sa evāyaṁ mayā te 'dya
- yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ
- bhakto 'si me sakhā ceti
- rahasyaṁ hy etad uttamam
- (BG 4.3)
Prabhupāda: This is the beginning.
Indian man (2): Fourth Chapter.
Prabhupāda: Read it again.
Devotee (1): "That very ancient science of the relation . . ."
Prabhupāda: No, no, that verse, śloka, you . . .
Devotee (1): Sa evāyaṁ mayā te 'dya . . . (BG 4.3).
Prabhupāda: Sa eva. Aham.
Devotee (1): Mayā te 'dya yogaḥ . . .
Prabhupāda: Mayā te 'dya yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. Now, Kṛṣṇa never said, although in Bhagavad-gītā yoga is spoken by Him, He never said that "Because now time has passed away, circumstance different, so I can say you in a new way." There is no such foolishness. But these people, they speak Bhagavad-gītā in a new way—more than Kṛṣṇa. These rascals are more than Kṛṣṇa. So we are guided by them. They think of themselves as more intelligent than Kṛṣṇa. This is the difficulty in India. (Hindi) Vyāsadeva says, bhagavān uvāca. (Hindi) Rascal ideas. Unnecessarily if one is proud without any qualification, he's a rascal. (Hindi) Or this is also said there, that bhakto 'si priyo 'si (BG 4.3). The system of Bhagavad-gītā, it can be understood only by the bhaktas. Otherwise why He should select Arjuna as the perfect audience? Because Arjuna was not a Vedāntist. He was gṛhastha, belonging to royal family. He was dealing in politics. So the so-called Vedāntists and sannyāsīs, they are supposed to be student of Bhagavad-gītā, but Kṛṣṇa selected him not because he was a Vedāntist . . . He was not even brāhmaṇa. He was kṣatriya, politician, gṛhastha, not Vedāntist, ordinary knowledge, but Kṛṣṇa selected him. (aside:) Hmm, don't do it.
Indian man (1): He was bhakta and sakhā.
Prabhupāda: Bhakta means he must be a servant, sakhā, or father or conjugal lover. They are bhaktas. There are five rasas. So a bhakta is situated in one of them: śānta, dāsya, sākhya, vātsalya . . . That is Vṛndāvana atmosphere. So bhakta means either of them. Arjuna sākhye. By friendship Arjuna became perfect, by making Kṛṣṇa as friend. Hanumān dāsye. Vajrāṅgajī, Hanumān, he, by serving Lord Rāmacandra, the order . . . He was not even human being, animal . . . (indistinct) . . . not very intelligent, but by giving service constantly, he worshiped with love. So as soon as you become a bhakta, you must be related with Kṛṣṇa with some rasa, in some particular position. That is bhakta.
So the point is that without becoming a bhakta, nobody can understand bhakti. A politician cannot understand. They simply make their artificial attempt to understand. They'll never understand. It is locked. Just like a bottle of honey. I give you, "Here is a bottle of honey," and if you, "Oh, it is honey. Let me lick up the bottle," so will you get the taste? So similarly, they are licking up the bottle, not inside. Rahasyam uttamam. They have no information. They are licking up bottle: "I am reading Bhagavad-gītā." This is the position. For this reason our country has fallen so much. But it can be revived again. The things are already there. Bhagavad-gītā is there. Kṛṣṇa is there. The instruction is there. If you take it, then it will immediately change the face of the whole world—immediately, without difficulty. But we are so stubborn, doggish, that we don't. We manufacture. This is going on. (Hindi) . . . yesterday. We are standing against the stubborn, doggish mentality. We have got no difficulty, at the same time, very, very difficult task. No difficulty—if you accept Bhagavad-gītā as it is, no difficulty. But you don't accept—there is great difficulty. In the foreign countries they are not stubborn, doggish. They accept what we say in the Bhagavad-gītā. Therefore these young men, they have very easily become devotees. (Hindi)
Indian man (4): (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) . . . that why we shall misinterpret Bhagavad-gītā? Kṛṣṇa was less intelligent, that He left Bhagavad-gītā to be interpreted by some rascal philosopher or politician? He was not intelligent enough to clear the idea? If Kurukṣetra is meant "body," why you should bring in the name of Kurukṣetra the bodily conception of life? What is this? Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre samavetā yuyutsavaḥ, māmakāḥ pāṇḍavāḥ (BG 1.1). Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre is still there. Why Kurukṣetra should be interpreted as something else?
Indian man (1): You have cautioned the reader in this translation.
Indian man (1): You have cautioned the reader to read the Bhagavad-gītā as it is.
Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the way. And their purpose is that "Bhagavad-gītā should be utilized for my rascaldom." This is going on. (Hindi) This is our mission. Don't manufacture nonsense. It will never be successful.
Indian man (3): This, all about nation, internationalness . . .
Prabhupāda: First of all, there is no question of nationalism. It is all bogus.
Indian man (3): No, that you have spoken. Our request is how best we can implement the teachings of Gītā in these critical days . . .
Prabhupāda: It is already there. It is already there. You kindly take it.
Indian man (3): How to implemant in our daily life . . .?
Prabhupāda: You understand. The difficulty is you do not understand even a line of Bhagavad-gītā. Still, you say that you are student of Bhagavad-gītā. This is difficulty.
Indian man (3): I see. Then how to understand it?
Prabhupāda: It is there already. But you are blind. You are cheater. You see things, one thing, and you speak another thing. You are cheating. Now, in the beginning of the Bhagavad-gītā, when Arjuna surrendered to Kṛṣṇa as a student—śiṣyas te 'haṁ śādhi māṁ prapannam (BG 2.7): "Kṛṣṇa, there will be no utility by arguing. I know that I am not doing my duty. I am kṣatriya. I am in the active field, and I am declining to fight. This is not good for me." Kārpaṇya-doṣopahata-svabhāvaḥ: "So I can understand that I am puzzled that 'How I can kill such enemies who are my family members?' This is my problem." (aside:) Here is a monkey. (Hindi)
Indian man (3): There are two. (laughter)
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) (laughter) And we want to be happy. Tri-tāpa-yantana,(?) three types of miseries, are always there. So Kṛṣṇa, when took charge of teaching him, the first lesson was that "Arjuna, you have talked like a very learned man, but you are not learned."
- aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ
- prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase
- gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca
- nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ
- (BG 2.11)
"You are taking care of the body, which is a lump of matter, combination of five elements—earth, water, air, fire—and you are concerned with this nonsense matter. You have no information of the real thing. And you are talking as a learned . . .?" This is the first. And then He said that "Actual person is within the body." Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanam . . . (BG 2.13). So as we are changing body in this status, from childhood to boyhood, boyhood to youth-hood, similarly, when you give up this body, you get another body. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ. So if you are destined to change your body, then where is your nationalism? Boliye. (Hindi) If you have to change your body . . . Today you are Indian. Tomorrow you become Pakistani. Then again fight.
Prabhupāda: This is going on. Today you are European; tomorrow you become Indian. And today you are man; tomorrow you become a dog. If you have got love for your country, but your work is doggish, then you become a dog. And who cares for the national dog? The street dog and the . . . At night he takes charge of the street. Nobody has appointed him, but he takes charge, and whole night: "Gow! Gow!" If somebody, new man, enters the neighborhood, "I am in charge." You see? "Why you have entered?" So this is going on. "I am leader of this country." So what is this civilization? Kṛṣṇa says that "I am the leader." He says, bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva-loka-maheśvaram, suhṛdaṁ sarva-bhūtānām (BG 5.29): "I am the leader. I am the friend, well-wisher of everyone." And if a dog says, "I am the leader. I am the well-wisher," so which way we shall go? I shall accept the dog as leader and well-wisher or Kṛṣṇa? Boliye. A barking dog or Kṛṣṇa?
Indian man (2): Naturally Kṛṣṇa.
Prabhupāda: Yes. And He says, suhṛdaṁ sarva-bhūtānām: "I can adjust things." So we are not taking it. (Hindi) From all angles of vision, if you study Bhagavad-gītā, everything is perfectly clear. And if you take it seriously, you become happy in this life and dehāntare. If you simply take, accept Kṛṣṇa as He says, then what is result? Kṛṣṇa says, janma karma me divyaṁ yo jānāti tattvataḥ tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma mām eti (BG 4.9). Punar janma, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). But one who has understood Kṛṣṇa perfectly—it is not possible to understand Him, but as far as possible, as far as our knowledge is concerned, if we understand Kṛṣṇa—then immediate result is that we are freed from the bondage of janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi (BG 13.9).
So that is the real problem. We are solving problems—this problem, that problem, that . . . They are not problems. That is natural in this material world. Just like this fly is disturbing. This is not a problem, because the fly is meant for that purpose. How . . . You cannot stop him. You can protect yourself. It is not possible to stop him. This is not problem, how to drive away the fly. The real problem, Kṛṣṇa says, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam, that you are in the cycle of birth, death . . . Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). You get another life and you suffer. Again you get another life. This is your problem. So that problem, Kṛṣṇa says, that "You can solve it. Simply try to understand Me." Janma karma me divyaṁ yo jānāti tattvataḥ, tyaktvā deham (BG 4.9). That is our business. But we are being deviated from the real business, and we are being engaged in so-called this ism, that ism, that ism. This is spoiling the whole thing.
- aśraddadhānāḥ puruṣā
- dharmasyāsya parantapa
- māṁ aprāpya nivartante
- (BG 9.3)
This life, this human form of life, is meant for understanding the real problem of life and to solve it. This is the opportunity. And Kṛṣṇa personally coming to instruct you, "You solve in this way." But we are so doggish, we will not take. What can be done? Then become a dog. Nature's law will work. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-janma-yoniṣu (BG 13.22). If you remain doggish—you do not become a human being—then, all right, you become a dog next life. Tathā dehāntara-prā . . . Then take life of the street and "Gow! Gow! Gow!" Mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani. This . . . For this purpose we request every one of you that you study Bhagavad-gītā very seriously as it is, apply it in your practical life and teach it to others. That is perfection. That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission, that "You become guru, everyone." (break) You simply repeat. Don't misinterpret. Boliye. This is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's . . . Every one of you become a guru, not a bluffer, but a guru, real guru. "How real guru? I can become? I have no qualification." Yāre dekha tāre kaha kṛṣṇa-upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128): "You simply take the words of Kṛṣṇa and preach." Kṛṣṇa says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). You simply repeat, "Sir, Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Being, God." What is the difficulty? Kṛṣṇa says, "There is no superior authority than Me." You simply say, "Kṛṣṇa is the supreme authority." That's all. Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī mām . . . You preach, "Come here in the temple. See Kṛṣṇa's Deity and always think of Him." Where is the difficulty? Now these Europeans and Americans, what I have done to them? I have not given any bribe. I say, "Here is Kṛṣṇa. He is God." They accept it, worship Him. Man-manā bhava mad-bhaktaḥ. Just if you cannot do anything, just offer one obeisances, namaskāra. Any child can do. They have done it, and they are going ahead. (Hindi) Kṛṣṇa-upadeśa is there, perfect upadeśa. (Hindi) As Kṛṣṇa says, you try to assimilate it and distribute it. There is no diffi . . . (Hindi) Kṛṣṇa says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nān . . . (Hindi) Eighty-four books, each book, four hundred pages, in ten years. And we are selling, collecting by selling books, five to six lakh of rupees daily in foreign countries. What is that qualification? We have tried to convince people that Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Being. Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (BS 5.1). (Hindi) "The Supreme Being is Kṛṣṇa." Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ. (Hindi) Sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ. Sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ. (Hindi) Form. Formlessness. Formless is another feature, but real feature is Śyāmasundara. Yaṁ śyāmasundaram acintya-guṇa-svarūpam.
- santaḥ sadaiva hṛdayeṣu vilokayanti
- yaṁ śyāmasundaram acintya-guṇa . . .
- govindam ādi-puruṣam . . .
- (BS 5.38)
The Govinda, Śyāmasundara, dvi-bhuja-muralīdhara. Here is the Supreme Being. Take His instruction. Always think of Him. You become perfect. Where is the difficulty? (Hindi) Why do you create difficult position? This is going on. (Hindi) Surrender to Kṛṣṇa, follow His instruction and be happy. (Hindi)
Indian man (4): (Hindi)
Indian man (1): Shameless.
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) "I don't care for you." (Hindi) Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, mama māyā. That means he's engaged, she's engaged for beating with shoes. But he cannot understand, although Kṛṣṇa is coming personally to make him understand, paritrāṇāya sādhūnām (BG 4.8). (Hindi) Mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te. You surrender to Kṛṣṇa; everything is finished. So it is up to you, whether you prefer to be beaten by shoes continually or you surrender to Kṛṣṇa. That depends on you. (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). Don't manufacture nonsense things. (Hindi) Rascaldom. "Simply surrender to Me." (Hindi) . . . manufacture . . . (Hindi) . . . ism, this ism, that ism, that ism. (Hindi) The Bhagavad-gītā is spoken in the Battlefield of Kurukṣetra. (Hindi) . . . nonviolence . . . (Hindi) Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre samavetā yuyutsavaḥ (BG 1.1). The first word is (Hindi). And you want to prove it, nonviolence. (Hindi) . . . rascaldom . . . (Hindi) The first word is used, yuyutsavaḥ. (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) Violence required to keep the society in order. (Hindi) Who will give protection? Sab scientific. (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) So "Don't trust woman and politician." This is Cāṇakya Paṇḍita. And she is both politician and woman. We have got Mahābhārata, there is not a single instance . . . We had very, very great, qualified women. But they were in charge of state . . .? Very, very qualified women. You know. Na svatantratām arhati, striyaḥ (Manu-saṁhitā). For woman there is no independence. The Manu-saṁhitā. They must stay under father, under husband or under elderly sons. Three stages. Kuntī . . .
Indian man (5): (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) A young girl cannot go out without father's, mother's . . . She cannot mix with any other young man. Strictly prohibited. (Hindi) If you want to revive real Indian civilization or Vedic civilization for the good of the whole human society, take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. You'll be happy. There is no doubt. (Hindi) Why do you try to undo something which is spoken by Bhagavān, Vyāsadeva? (Hindi) So how can you make nonviolence? (Hindi) Mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ (CC Madhya 17.186). We are not following mahājana, but we are transgressing. (Hindi) (aside:) Bring. Bring cutting. Dharmasya tattvaṁ nihitaṁ guhāyāṁ mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ. And mahājanas are also mentioned,
- svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ
- kapila kumāraḥ manuḥ
- prahlādo janako bhīṣmo
- balir vaiyāsakir vayam
- (SB 6.3.20)
(Hindi conversation) We want to become artificially rascal, mahājana. That is going on. (Hindi) Sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66): "Whatever you have learned, forget." Mām ekam. Because he has become too much bewildered, He doesn't say anybody else. Mām ekam, word to the mūrkhas . . . Śaraṇaṁ vraja. (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhāḥ (BG 9.11). (Hindi with scattered English words) Why do you take Bhagavad-gītā? The beginning, the first line, is yuyutsavaḥ. Where is nonviolence? (Hindi)
Indian man (6): How can you fight a war and then be nonviolent at the same time?
Indian man (6): How is it possible to be nonviolent . . .
Prabhupāda: Why you want nonviolence?
Indian man (6): They are talking so much about nonviolence . . .
Prabhupāda: Just like here is a monkey. Is it not violence sometimes to drive it then? There will be attack, and you have to protect yourself. This world is not like that, that there is no . . . It is not Vaikuṇṭha. It is material world. There will be attack. Even if you are not . . . you are nonviolent, the others will be violent. Others will set fire in your house without any fault. They'll kidnap your wife. This is going on all over the world. You must protect yourself. (Hindi) How you can stop him? Thieves and rogues, even if you are nonviolent, they will come, take advantage. It is your duty.
Indian man (6): What is meant by nonviolence?
Prabhupāda: It has no meaning.
Indian man (6): It has no meaning?
Prabhupāda: Simply imagination, that's all. (Hindi conversation) (Hindi) . . . proper use . . . (Hindi) This is the meaning. You cannot abolish it. That is not possible.
Indian man (7): What is to world Mahatma Gandhi's nonviolence or . . .
Prabhupāda: I do not wish to discuss nonviolen . . . But we are talking of philosophy, that you cannot stop violence. That is not possible.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Kṛṣṇa says, mām anusmara yudhya ca (BG 8.7).
Prabhupāda: Yes. Yudhya ca. (Hindi conversation) There is some word, the meaning is not clear, then you can suggest that "Meaning may be like this." But when it is clear, there is no, I mean to say, chance of interpreting.
Indian man (1): As, for example, vicāra, those such words which requires some clarification or . . . these can be interpreted like . . .
Prabhupāda: No, no, when it is clear, why it should be interpreted?
Indian man (1): No, for other words . . .
Prabhupāda: Other words . . . (Hindi) . . . that when it is clear—yudhya ca—then why should you interpret? The example is there in the Sanskrit grammar. Just like . . . The example is given, where interpretation required. It is said, example is given, like gaṅgāyāṁ ghoṣa-pāli, that "There is a neighborhood called Ghosha-pali on the Ganges." So then you can ask that "Gaṅgā is water. How there is a neighborhood?" Then the interpretation: "Not on the Ganges water but on the bank."
Indian man (1): (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: Then interpretation. But when it is clear that "On the bank of the Ganges there is a neighborhood called Ghosha-pali," then where is interpretation? Interpretation will be required when the meaning is not clear. Otherwise, if the meaning is clear, that is (Hindi), to interpret. But in Bhagavad-gītā, in the first line, the word is used, yuyutsvaḥ, "desiring to fight." So desiring to fight, they assembled; they must fight. So where is the question of interpretation? (aside:) So prasādam ready or not?
Trivikrama(?): Yeah. About 6:30, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Every day there'll be darśana, five to six. Every day.
Indian man (7): (Hindi)
Prabhupāda: Hmm? What is that?
Indian man (8): There is a big hall here.
Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: There's a hall over here.
Indian man (8): There is a big hall here where a lot of people can come, because lot of people want to listen you.
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) (Hindi conversation)
Indian man (8): It is only fifty steps, hundred feet, yes, not more than that.
Prabhupāda: (Hindi) (Hindi conversation)
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's raining again.
Prabhupāda: You have shown our books to these gentlemen?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We have a few books here.
Prabhupāda: Hmm. You can show some of them. (Hindi conversation) Call him. You can perform kīrtana here. (Hindi conversation). So go to the hall and begin kīrtana immediately. You can go. (Hindi conversation)
Indian man (8): Tomorrow. Tomorrow evening, five till six. So you can go and have kīrtana.
Indian man (1): Right now, right now. Gurujī said we can go to the . . . (laughter)
Prabhupāda: (chuckling) You can go and have kīrtana.
Indian man (7): But we can start here also.
Indian man (7): Here for some time . . .
Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. (kīrtana begins) (break) Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). (Hindi) (end).