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770528 - Conversation B - Vrndavana

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

770528ME-VRNDAVAN - May 28, 1977 - 22:51 Minutes

(GBC meets with Srila Prabhupada)

Prabhupāda: This paper was started, one page, this. Now it has developed.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Now it's the biggest paper in this area, Hindi paper, Amara Jana. In Agra, Vṛndāvana, Mathurā. They have written about us several times. Even when the road was changed to Bhaktivedanta Swami Marg, we had a press conference—I was there—and they reproduced it that Chattikara Road name had been changed to Bhaktivedanta Swami Marg.

Prabhupāda: What is that photograph?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: They have one of your photographs.

Prabhupāda: Which one?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: On the right. Walking on the beach, I think.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Transcendental autocrat."

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Lord Caitanya's picture is also there.

Bhakti-caru: (reads in Hindi headline "Fifth Avenue Hare Kṛṣṇa Saṅkīrtana")

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Bali-mardana's picture is there. He was leading that kīrtana party then.

Bhakti-caru: Was it written by the same person who wrote this book?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, no, no. No.

Bhakti-caru: I mean, this Caitanya Mahāprabhu Śikṣāmṛta.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No.

Bhakti-caru: Somebody else.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah.

Bhakti-caru: Yet that style of writing is quite alike. (break)

Prabhupāda: When I go to Los Angeles I am in Vaikuṇṭha. When I go to New York I am in Vaikuṇṭha. Wherever we have got temple, that is Vaikuṇṭha. So why shall I have objection? So do your duty nicely and see what Kṛṣṇa desires. Let it be fulfilled. But you do your duty. It is your duty to pray to Kṛṣṇa as affectionate children, and let Kṛṣṇa decide. And I have no objection, either. So, what is the next?

Girirāja: Well, in continuation of arranging for the properties and other things to be managed . . .

Prabhupāda: He has . . . Bhagatjī is proposed for the trustee?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: Which?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Of Vṛndāvana, Kṛṣṇa-Balarāma Trust.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa-Balarāma Trust.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We proposed to you.

Prabhupāda: That's right . . . Bhagatjī and?

Girirāja: Gopāla Kṛṣṇa and Akṣayānanda Swami.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Girirāja: And we were also going to add Gurukṛpā Mahārāja, because he gave so much money.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Girirāja: And also for Māyāpur, add him as a trustee.

Prabhupāda: Very good. So do it. His condition will take some time. He has agreed. When he's gone? . . . (indistinct)

Girirāja: Then for the bank accounts, the main fund is the ISKCON Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana fixed deposits and savings account. So we thought that the best thing would be to have a committee to oversee the spending of this money in terms of your desire. So we propose that the committee consist of Gurukṛpā Mahārāja, Rāmeśvara Mahārāja, Jayapatākā Mahārāja, Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Goswami, Gopāla Kṛṣṇa and myself.

Prabhupāda: Very good. Approved.

Girirāja: This would represent Gurukṛpā, who's collecting also the money, and Rāmeśvara.

Prabhupāda: I think you are all competent. Very good selection. Do it.

Girirāja: Then the persons who sign the checks, they would do so according to the decision made by the . . .

Prabhupāda: Of this committee.

Girirāja: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Girirāja: And then the signers would be, in Bombay, Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Goswami, Gopāla Kṛṣṇa and myself—two out of the three. And then in Los Angeles, jointly, Rāmeśvara Mahārāja and Satsvarūpa Mahārāja.

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Girirāja: Then, for the BBT, the idea would be that the principal amount should not be touched, but it can be given, you know, for loan if absolutely necessary, just as you have been doing. But the idea is that that amount should always be repaid.

Prabhupāda: On principle.

Girirāja: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: But when there is necessity, it should not be agitated, it should be given. Even by chance it is not paid, don't mind. Business should not suffer. That's all.

Girirāja: Yes.

Prabhupāda: If you can provide, you must, of course, see that business is done. And then they should try to pay. If they are actually not able to pay, don't mind. Is that all right?

Rāmeśvara: Yes, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Principle should be they should return back. But if by chance they cannot, don't press. Let them go on with business. But don't be lenient. (laughter)

Jayatīrtha: I think they'll be able to pay.

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They should want to pay, out of duty to you.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa will give them. You are increasing the book sale. That is Kṛṣṇa's favor. Kṛṣṇa is assuring, "Don't be disturbed about money matters. I'll pay you." But don't be very loose or extravagant. Every paisa should be spent very cautiously. That is wanted. So it is all right.

Girirāja: So the signers on this account would be Tamāla Kṛṣṇa, Gopāla Kṛṣṇa and myself—two out of three.

Prabhupāda: Don't open many accounts at the bank. The same signer, one or two of them must sign the . . . the accounts may be in your books, but there is no necessity of opening so many accounts and different signers. That is not necessary.

Girirāja: Right. So these are actually the same signers as the Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Fund.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Girirāja: And in some cases . . . I mean, there are different accounts distributed in different places that should be . . .

Prabhupāda: That you can keep in your books, not in the bank.

Girirāja: So all the funds can be consolidated . . .

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Girirāja: . . . in the accounts in Bombay.

Prabhupāda: Yes. To see your accounts . . .

Jayapatākā: This evening we're going to change the names.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Girirāja: No, no, what he's saying . . .

Rāmeśvara: We should consolidate the accounts. Just on paper keep it simple.

Girirāja: Yeah. And then for the BBT money the decision to give out loan should be unanimously approved by all three of us—Tamāla Kṛṣṇa, Gopāla and myself.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Girirāja: Then the accounts in your personal name . . . we thought that those funds could be transferred to the Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Fund, just as you suggested, and just keep our own account, how it is spent in terms of your desire.

Prabhupāda: Yes. You can transfer at any moment.

Girirāja: And then for the fixed deposits, the interest for your family members, that we would just leave them in your name, as it's mentioned in the will, and throughout their life they will get that interest.

Prabhupāda: That we shall do. I shall . . . how to do it. For the time being you haven't got to bother.

Girirāja: No.

Prabhupāda: So that I shall pay.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We also felt that. We wouldn't bother with that.

Prabhupāda: That's nice. Very good.

Girirāja: So we are . . .

Prabhupāda: Do it very nicely, cool-headed. Mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca (BG 15.15). We shall be always prepared to take instruction from Kṛṣṇa. That is best.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hmm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's a kīrtana party waiting to come in.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Come on.

Jayapatākā: And I think your prasādam.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes, there's some prasādam for you.

Prabhupāda: Prasādam? I am not just now very much willing. And if I require, I shall call for it.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: All right. Kīrtana party should be called?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Devotees: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Jaya. (devotees offer obeisances) (break)

Satsvarūpa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, we were all asked by the rest of the GBC to come to ask some questions. Most . . . these are the members of the original GBC as you first made it up. So our first question is about the GBC members. We want to know how long should they remain in office?

Prabhupāda: They should remain for good.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They should remain for good.

Prabhupāda: Selected men are chosen, so they cannot be changed. Rather, if some competent man comes, he should be added. I shall recommend that Vāsudeva to become one of the GBC.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Vāsudeva is Deoji Punja. He's the founder of our . . . he's building the temple in Fiji.

Prabhupāda: How many GBCs are there already?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Twenty-three.

Prabhupāda: So add him. GBC is not to be changed.

Satsvarūpa: But then, in the event that some present GBC member leaves, either leaves . . .

Prabhupāda: Another should be elected.

Satsvarūpa: By the votes of the present GBC. Then our next question concerns initiations in the future, particularly at that time when you're no longer with us. We want to know how first and second initiation would be conducted.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I shall recommend some of you. After this is settled up, I shall recommend some of you to act as officiating ācāryas.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Is that called ṛtvik-ācārya?

Prabhupāda: Ṛtvik, yes.

Satsvarūpa: Then what is the relationship of that person who gives the initiation and the . . .

Prabhupāda: He's guru. He's guru.

Satsvarūpa: But he does it on your behalf.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is formality. Because in my presence one should not become guru, so on my behalf, on my order . . . āmāra ājñāya guru hañā (CC Madhya 7.128). Be actually guru, but by my order.

Satsvarūpa: So they may also be considered your disciples.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they are disciples. Why consider? Who?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, he's asking that these ṛtvik-ācāryas, they're officiating, giving dīkṣā. Their . . . the people who they give dīkṣā to, whose disciple are they?

Prabhupāda: They're his disciple.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're his disciple.

Prabhupāda: Who is initiating. He is granddisciple.

Satsvarūpa: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's clear.

Satsvarūpa: Then we have a question concer . . .

Prabhupāda: When I order, "You become guru," he becomes regular guru. That's all. He becomes disciple of my disciple. That's it.

Satsvarūpa: Next we have a question about the BBT. At present, no translation work is to be published without your seeing and approving it. So the question is, is there any system for publishing works in the future that you may not see? For example, we've heard suggested that the Padma Purāṇa or the Ṣaṭ-Sandarbha may be translated. But what would the system be to insure the paramparā if you would not personally see these translations?

Prabhupāda: That you have to examine expertly.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In other words, there's no set principle that only the works which you have already translated can be published by the BBT. If there is some worthy translation of a bona fide Vedic reference, if it's properly done, the BBT could publish it.

Prabhupāda: That we are doing, just like Hindi. We are doing other languages. If it is properly translated, it can be . . .

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Even if it's a work which you have not yet translated yourself.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no, the principle is . . . just like my translation, another person translating into Hindi or other languages, we are publishing. Similarly, if somebody has translated properly, it can be published. But amongst our disciples, I don't think there are many who can translate properly.

Rāmeśvara: None. We're not eager to publish anything which is not perfect, because you have already set the highest standard for the BBT. The name BBT means the highest standard right now in the world.

Prabhupāda: That is good . . . (indistinct)

Kīrtanānanda: Therefore, Śrīla Prabhupāda, we think that you cannot leave us very soon.

Prabhupāda: I don't want. But if I am obliged, what can I do?

Kīrtanānanda: If you don't want, Kṛṣṇa will not want.

Prabhupāda: A realized soul, must be. Otherwise, simply by imitating A-B-C-D will not help. My purports are liked by people because it is presented as practical experience. (aside) It is within the mouth. (referring to microphone)

Bhavānanda: I'm sorry.

Prabhupāda: Such a nice instrument, (laughter) that it must enter into the mouth? Then it will act? That kind of instrument not required. It must remain three miles off. Our translation must be documented. They are not ordinary . . . one cannot become unless one is very realized. It is not A-B-C-D translation.

Bhagavān: It's not a matter of scholarship.

Prabhupāda: And Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, āmāra ājñāya guru hañā (CC Madhya 7.128). One can understand the order of Caitanya Mahāprabhu, he can become guru. Or one who understands his guru's order, the same paramparā, he can become guru. And therefore I shall select some of you. (hums)

Satsvarūpa: That's all the questions.

Prabhupāda: So there is no question of changing GBC.

Satsvarūpa: No.

Prabhupāda: Rather, one who is competent, he can be selected to act by the board of the GBC.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Of course, if someone has a falldown, just like in the past some GBC men have fallen down . . .

Prabhupāda: He should be replaced.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Then he should be replaced. But that's a serious falldown, not some minor discrepancy.

Prabhupāda: They must be all ideal ācārya-like. In the beginning we have done for working. Now we should be very cautious. Anyone who is deviating, he can be replaced.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So Śrīla Prabhupāda, there's a chanting party ready to do some kīrtana. So may they come in?

Prabhupāda: Hmm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Thank you, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Devotees: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Jaya. (end)