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770325 - Lecture SB 05.05.01-2 - Bombay

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

770325SB-BOMBAY - March 25, 1977 - 32:17 Minutes

Prabhupāda: Next verse.


mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimuktes
tamo-dvāraṁ yoṣitāṁ saṅgi-saṅgam
mahāntas te sama-cittāḥ praśāntā
vimanyavaḥ suhṛdaḥ sādhavo ye
(SB 5.5.2)

"One can attain the path of liberation from material bondage only by rendering service to highly advanced spiritual personalities. These personalities are impersonalists and devotees. Whether one wants to merge into the Lord's existence or wants to associate with the Personality of Godhead, one should render service to the mahātmās. For those who are not interested in such activities, who associate with people fond of women and sex, the path to hell is wide open. The mahātmās are equipoised. They do not see any difference between one living entity and another. They are very peaceful and are fully engaged in devotional service. They are devoid of anger, and they work for the benefit of everyone. They do not behave in any abominable way. Such people are known as mahātmās."

Prabhupāda: So Mr. Jyesthish Gandhi, Ladies and Gentlemen, the instruction of Ṛṣabhadeva is very important. Ṛṣabhadeva was the father of Mahārāja Bhārata, under whose name this planet is called Bhāratavarṣa. So before retirement, Ṛṣabhadeva instructed His one hundred sons about the aim of life. This is the duty of the father, to instruct his sons about the aim of life. So this is Vedic civilization. So He says, "My dear boys, don't spoil your life by living like hogs." This very word has been used. Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛ-loke kaṣṭān kāmān arhate viḍ-bhujāṁ ye (SB 5.5.1). Viḍ-bhujāṁ. Viḍ-bhujāṁ means there are hogs who are very much enthusiastic to eat stool. So why this particular animal has been named? Because we can find, especially in Indian villages, the hog, day and night, they are working very hard to find out where there is stool. And as soon as he eats stool, the hog very easily become fatty and strong. Therefore a class of men, they like to eat the flesh of hog because it becomes easily fatty. And the hog's business is, as soon as he gets little strength, then next business is sex, without any discrimination. The hog has no discrimination who is sister, who is mother, who is daughter. So therefore this particular animal has been named, and Ṛṣabhadeva warns His sons that "Don't live the life of hogs. Live like human being."

That is wanted. And for that purpose you require to execute tapasya. Tapasā brahmacaryeṇa śamena damena va (SB 6.1.13). These are the injunction of the śāstras. Human life is meant for tapasya, not to imitate the hogs and dogs. This is not human life. This is Vedic culture. The Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is trying to give this Vedic culture all over the world, but they are after hogs and dogs. What can be done? This is very difficult job. But still we have to do, because we have placed ourself to become servant of Kṛṣṇa. Never mind we have to face so many dangerous positions; still we have to do this thankless task. "My dear brothers, do not be hogs and dogs. Be a saintly person." This is our mission. That is India's culture. Bhagavad-gītā, the same thing said: manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye (BG 7.3). Siddhi. Siddhi means perfection. Nobody is interested how to make this life perfect. Everyone is being carried away by the waves of material nature. This is not life. Śrīla Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, a Bengali Vaiṣṇava poet, he has written one song, kena māyāra vaśe yāccha bhese kāccha hābu ḍubu bhāi. Jīva kṛṣṇadāsa ei viśvāsa korleto ār duḥkha nai.

Māyāra vaśe. There is the laws of nature. We are under the grip of laws of nature. You cannot violate. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). If you have touched fire, it doesn't matter whether you are elderly person or a child; innocent or knowingly or unknowingly, the fire must burn. There is no excuse. Similarly, we are contaminating different types of modes of nature. There are three modes of material nature—sattva-guṇa, raja-guṇa and tamo-guṇa. Now mix it up, three into three equal to nine, nine into nine it becomes eighty-one. Again eighty-one . . . it increases. Those who are expert in mixing color, they know how to make different colors by mixing the original three colors: blue, yellow and red. Similarly, we are in this material world under the clutches of the modes of material nature, and according to different circumstances we are mixing with different modes of nature. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-yoniṣu (BG 13.22). Because we are mixing with different types of material nature, next life we are preparing. Tatha dehāntara praptir. We have to accept another body. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya. This is our position. Don't be very happy that "Today I am such and such big person. It will continue." No, sir, it will not continue. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). You have to change your body.

So we have to understand this responsibility of life. That is human life—not to enjoy senses by imitating the hogs and dogs. This is not human civilization. We have to learn from the śāstras how our life is being transformed from one form to another, and there are 8,400,000 different species of life. Once this human form of life missed, and if you are put into these waves of birth and death, then the opportunity finished. We must always be alert that we have got this responsibility. The Ṛṣabhadeva says that tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyed sattva (SB 5.5.1). Sattva means existence. Your existence is eternal. That is the first information in the Bhagavad-gītā. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). Na jāyate na mriyate vā. This is the first instruction. There are so many commentator or instructor of Bhagavad-gītā, but they are missing the first instruction. They are not interested that "What is going to happen my next life?" They are not interested. Nobody takes care. They have concluded they have no life after death. This body is finished, everything is finished. Most irresponsible life. This is not to be carried on. Ṛṣabhadeva says that "My dear sons, don't live this irresponsible life like animals, hogs and dogs, but take the responsibility of human life. Undergo austerities, penances, as they are recommended in the śāstras, and make your life . . ." It is individual. If this movement cannot be taken massively, every individual can practice it. That is Indian culture. Every Indian was educated how to become a brāhmaṇa, for coming to this platform of austerity. And following the examples of brāhmaṇa, the kṣatriya and the vaiśyas and the śūdras, they also benefited.

So this is a very elaborate scientific subject matter, and we are trying to present all over the world. Why not our Indian brothers take it very seriously? Why we should be carried away by the waves of material nature? This is not very good idea. Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyed sattva (SB 5.5.1). Sattva, my existence. At the present moment . . . just like I am coughing. So because I am, for the present moment, I am diseased, so this is the symptom of coughing. Similarly, why I am dying? This should be the question. Ke āmi kena more jāpaṭiyā traya. I hear from Bhagavad-gītā that I am eternal: na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). Na jāyate na mriyate vā. Then why I am dying? This is intelligence. Why I am dying? This "why." Kena Upaniṣad. But this is not being educated. We are carried away by the temporary problems and missing the chance of human life. This is not very good, and Ṛṣabhadeva especially instructs that mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimuktes. If you actually want liberation from these clutches of māyā—vimukti, vimukti . . . vimukti means liberation. What is liberation? Muktir hitvā anyathā rūpaṁ svarūpeṇa avasthitiḥ (SB 2.10.6). We are living in a different way. This is not mukti. This is conditioned. I am living as Indian condition, I am living as European condition—this is not mukti. You must live in your original form. That is called mukti. Muktir hitvā anyathā rūpam. Now we are living anyathā rūpam. Somebody is living as Indian, somebody is living as European, somebody as cat, somebody as dog, somebody . . . this is anyathā rūpam. You must realize yourself,

brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā
na śocati na kāṅkṣati
samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu
mad-bhaktiṁ labhate param
(BG 18.54)

So Dr. Jyestish gave stress on bhakti. That is very good idea. So simply by becoming bhakta . . . kevalayā . . . kecid kevalayā bhaktyā vāsudeva-parayaṇaḥ (SB 6.1.15). Kevalayā bhakta. Simply if you take to the process of bhakti . . . that is recommended in the Bhagavad-gītā also: bhaktyā mām abhijānāti (BG 18.55). If you want to know God, if you want to know the relationship with God, if you know what is your business after understanding God, then bhakti. Kṛṣṇa says. Kṛṣṇa, no . . . although there are different ways of self-realization—karma, jñāna, yoga, bhakti—these are the principles. But Kṛṣṇa recommends that "If you want to know Me actually, then bhaktyā." Kṛṣṇa teaches Arjuna Bhagavad-gītā because Arjuna was a devotee. Bhakto 'si me priyo 'si (BG 4.3): "Because you are My dear friend and bhakta, therefore I am teaching you."

So bhakti-mārga is not very difficult. Very easy. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). Any child can do it. Any child, if he sees the form of Lord Kṛṣṇa in the temple, he remembers, and he continues to think of Kṛṣṇa. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto. And if you think of Kṛṣṇa always, automatically you become devotee. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto. And then mad-yājī, little offering. Patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). Where is the difficulty? Little flower, little fruit, little water. Kṛṣṇa is not poor person, He wants something from you. But yo me bhaktyā prayacchati. He wants to revive your original Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Therefore He comes. Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata (BG 4.7). So in India we have got this opportunity. Why should we miss this opportunity? It is a suicidal policy. Don't do it. Take to it very seriously.

Thank you very much.

Devotees: Jaya, Śrīla Prabhupāda! (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Who is going to be the leading? If anyone has any questions, this is the time. The process of receiving knowledge is to place inquiry at the perfect person, the spiritual master. So if any of you have any questions, there will be a microphone up front, and you can come up and place your questions to Śrīla Prabhupāda. (no one responds)

Devotee: Who is going to be the leading?

Prabhupāda: All right. Don't try to agitate them. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Oh, they are coming?

Guest (1): If God is everywhere, why His presence is not felt by everybody?

Prabhupāda: Everybody is not intelligent. Mostly they are rascals.

manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu
kaścid yatati siddhaye
yatatām api siddhānāṁ
kaścid vetti māṁ tattvataḥ
(BG 7.3)

This is the statement by God, that "Out of millions and millions of persons, one tries to become perfect. And out of many millions of perfect persons, one may understand God." So God understanding is not so easy, but if we want to understand, God will help us. That is the point.

Guest (1): Thank you.

Guest (2): I want to ask two separate questions. One question is number one. What is the meaning of the giving up of the fruition of action?

Prabhupāda: Karmaṇy evādhikāras te mā phaleṣu kadācana (BG 2.47). This is the . . . action and reaction, there are two things. But under both headings, action and reaction means you become bound up. Yajñārthe karma anyatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanam (BG 3.9). This is the statement, that if you work for yajña—yajña means Viṣṇu—then it is all right. Otherwise you become under the laws of karma, good or bad. You have to suffer or enjoy. There is no question of enjoyment; there is suffering. Therefore one should be taught not to accept the result of karma, but do it for Kṛṣṇa, yajñārthe. Then you are free.

Guest (2): When the fruit comes, should we give it up?

Prabhupāda: No. The fruit you can take as prasādam. Prasāde sarve-duḥkhānāṁ hānir asyopajāyate (BG 2.65). When you take as prasādam, then you are not bound up. But if you enjoy it as your fruitive result, then you have to suffer or enjoy. That is not good.

Guest (2): We have that difficulty with us.

Prabhupāda: No difficulty.

Guest (2): Because when the fruit comes, we cannot distinguish whether it is a ripened one or the wrong one. How to distinguish?

Prabhupāda: Yes. So it is said clearly, yajñārthe. You work for yajña. Kṛṣṇārthe. Yajña, another name of Kṛṣṇa or Viṣṇu. Then it is all right. Otherwise you will have to suffer.

Guest (2): My next question is . . .

Prabhupāda: First of all, you understand this question, that you have to work for Yajña. Then you are free. Otherwise you will be entangled.

Guest (2): Right. My next question is, I don't think God is opposed to sex. Seriously. I have heard many a lecture, and it is always stressed that as if the God is opposed to sex. But I don't think that's so. And from Gītā, Kṛṣṇa Himself says . . .

Prabhupāda: (aside to Tamāla Kṛṣṇa) Opposed to sex?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: (aside to Prabhupāda) He says he doesn't think God is opposed to sex.

Prabhupāda: God is never opposed to sex. Who said? God said, dharmaviruddhaḥ kāmo 'smi: "Sex which is not against the regulative principle of religious life, that I am." God never says that "Stop sex." Otherwise, why there is gṛhastha āśrama? Āśrama means that there is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. As soon as we say, "Here is an āśrama," we understand that there is consciousness of Kṛṣṇa. So brahmacārī āśrama, gṛhastha āśrama, vānaprastha āśrama, sannyāsa āśrama. Make it āśrama and follow the rules and regulations of āśrama. Then it is all right. Otherwise you are bound up by the laws of nature.

Guest (2): As we heard in the beginning, one of the principal statements that a man goes on the motor train, stands there for two hours, reaches his place of business, and work there from nine o'clock in the morning to five o'clock in the evening, returns back, has his food and sex and all that. I found many a people who have worked very hard, raised children very nicely, have sex, but lead a good life. I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

Prabhupāda: Yes, if there is no wrong, it is all right. But this sort of life is not very palatable.

Guest (2): Because I find even the dogs . . .

Prabhupāda: If you like that life, it is very good. That is up to you. But I don't think this is a very nice way of life, to work so hard simply for bread.

Guest (2): No, I agree there.

Prabhupāda: Then agreed, agreed. Then why disagree? (laughter) That's all right, no more.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's another question, Prabhupāda. A different man.

Prabhupāda: Yes?

Guest (3): Karma is the cause of also the cycle of death and birth. So virtuous karma of action, liberation of man are inclined to the Supreme. If it is so, that is called mokṣa. If it is so, what is the first cause that should denial me from the Supreme or the action?

Prabhupāda: Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya (BG 13.22), we have already mentioned. Kāraṇam, the first cause. Guṇa-saṅgo 'sya. As soon as you want to associate with the modes of material nature, then you are bound up, immediately, by the modes of material nature. Then your work begins. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya. That is natural. Actually, every living entity is constitutionally the servant of Kṛṣṇa, but when he wants to enjoy without Kṛṣṇa, without becoming servant of Kṛṣṇa, he wants to enjoy independently this material nature, then he has to associate with the modes of material nature, and he becomes bound up. Yajñārthe karma anyatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). So you have to know or study all these understanding. Then you will understand what is what. That's all.

Guest (3): No, when we are with the Kṛṣṇa . . .

Prabhupāda: Huh, what is that?

Guest (3): . . . then we are in supreme bliss.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Guest (3): When we are with Kṛṣṇa, we are enjoying the supreme bliss there. As soon as we come to this material world we are in a miserable condition.

Prabhupāda: Well, this is natural.

Guest (3): Why did we left Śrī Kṛṣṇa and came to this world? What was the cause? There was no action at all.

Prabhupāda: There is cause: kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya (BG 13.22). There is master and servant. The servant sometimes desires, "Why not become a master?" That is natural. So . . .

Guest (3): No. When I was with Kṛṣṇa, I was . . . matter was a part that my master is served.

Prabhupāda: You are master? You are kicked by the material nature, and you are master? Why you are so falsely proud? You are not master.

Guest (3): But you said that the mokṣa is I am, once . . .

Prabhupāda: Mokṣa means that when you are eternal servant of Kṛṣṇa. When you desire to become master of the world, then you become bound up. And when you give up this artificial desire, that is mokṣa.

Guest (3): Thank you. (break)

Guest (4): Would you agree that God is just a concept? If you do not, please give a logical reason for that.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Guest (4): Would you agree that God is just a concept? If you do not agree to that, please explain it logically.

Prabhupāda: Why shall I agree, God is only concept?

Guest (4): Because I want it logically.

Prabhupāda: You do not know logic. (laughter) You have to learn logic.

Guest (4): But I still would like you to explain it logically.

Prabhupāda: Yes, but you have to learn how to know it. There is master. There is master. Just like you cannot prove logically that without father there is a child. This is no logic.

Guest (4): Not without logic.

Prabhupāda: This is no logic. There cannot be any child without father. Therefore if anyone thinks that without father there can be child, he is animal. He has no logic.

Guest (4): But still the question is unanswered. Would you agree that God is just a concept?

Prabhupāda: No, no. There must be father. Just like you see everything is growing out of this earth. Sarva-yoniṣu kaunteya saṁbhavanti mūrtayaḥ yaḥ (BG 14.4). So there is mother, there is child. Where is the father? This is logic. Unless you come to this point, that there is mother, there is child, there must be father, then there is no logic. Without father there cannot be child. Simply mother cannot give birth to a child. This is logic.

Guest (4): Thank you.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Now chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. (end)