721231 - Lecture BG 13.02-4 - Bombay

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His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

721231BG-BOMBAY - December 31, 1972 - 31:56 Minutes

Pradyumna: "I am also the knower in all bodies, and to understand this body and its owner is called knowledge. That is my opinion." (BG 13.3)

Prabhupāda: So everyone, everyone gives his opinion. Kṛṣṇa also says opinion. So whose opinion we shall accept? If we take votes, whose opinion we shall accept? Kṛṣṇa says, mataṁ mama: "This is My opinion." Knowledge means to understand the owner of the body and the body. The body and the owner-body—not the same thing. Just like the owner of the house and the house, they're not the same thing. And knowledge means one should know what is this house and who is the owner. That is knowledge.

But they're mixing. In the modern age they are mixing the owner of the house and the house. Mixing together. And this is ignorance. They're identifying this body as self. The self is the owner of the body, and the body is different. Body is made of matter: earth, water, air, fire, ether, mind, intelligence, ego. This is the combination of the body. And the soul is different. The soul is governing the body, utilizing the body, working on the body. Therefore it is, in the beginning, it is said:

idaṁśarīraṁ kaunteya
kṣetram ity abhidhīyate
(BG 13.2)

This body is kṣetra, field of activity. Just like we are in Bombay, everyone is busy actively. So Bombay is the field of activity; you are not Bombay. If one identifies himself with this Bombay city—"I am Bombay"– this is foolishness. Bombay city is different from me, but I am working in Bombay city in different capacity. This is knowledge. Just try to understand, that people are identifying that, "I am body." This is not good.

kṣetra-jñaṁ cāpi māṁ viddhi
sarva-kṣetreṣu bhārata
kṣetra-kṣetrajñayor jñānaṁ
yat taj jñānaṁ mama
(BG 13.3)

People are . . . people are very much proud of their knowledge. But Kṛṣṇa says that knowledge means kṣetra-kṣetrajñayor jñānaṁ. Knowledge means to know the field and the actual proprietor of the field. Kṣetra-kṣetrajñayor jñānaṁ yat taj jñānaṁ. That knowledge is real knowledge. Mataṁ mama: Kṛṣṇa is giving His opinion. Now clear it, if we identify the kṣetra and the kṣetrajñayor are two, mixed up, that is ignorance. That is not knowledge. But just try to understand, people are under the impression that "I am this body." This is not knowledge; this is ignorance.

Then He says, kṣetra-jñaṁ cāpi māṁ viddhi. Yesterday we discussed the first verse, that:

idaṁśarīraṁ kaunteya
kṣetram ity abhidhīyate
(BG 13.2)

Kṣetram ity abhidhīyate. This body is the field of activities, and:

idaṁśarīraṁ kaunteya
kṣetram ity abhidhīyate
etad yo vetti
(BG 13.2)

And one who knows this:

etad yo vetti taṁ prāhuḥ
kṣetra-jña iti tad-vidaḥ
(BG 13.2)

One who knows perfectly that, "I am the proprietor of this body. I am utilizing this body for my purpose. The body is made of matter, and I am the spirit soul, part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa," this is perfect knowledge. This is perfect knowledge. And one who foolishly identifying that, "I am this body—I am this hand, I am this leg, I am this blood, I am this stool," he's not in knowledge. He's not in knowledge.

A combination of blood, stool, urine, muscle, bones—does it mean a spirit soul? Can you do it? There are many philosophers, they say that the combination of these bones, muscles, all the material things, produces the living energy. But why don't you do it? Eh? There are so many opportunities, so much opportunity that you can get blood also, bone also, and flesh also, urine also, stool also—why don't you manufacture a body?

Manufacture a body. No, it is not possible. These material things grow on the spirit soul. When the spirit soul takes shelter into the womb of a particular mother, then these things grow. Seed. Seed is the spirit soul. Just like a seed of a big banyan tree—you put within the earth and take care, put water, it will grow, a very big tree, with thousands and millions of figs. And in each figs, thousands and millions of seed. And each seed containing another tree. This is creation of God.

So matter does not produce living force. The living entity produces matter. This is the philosophy. Matter is their opinion. The Buddha philosophy, Jain philosophy, they do not believe in the existence of God as the origin. But this matter, when combined together, it produces a living force. But that is not the thing. Living force, or the living entity, produces matter. Try to understand. Matter does not produce living entity. That is not fact. The living entity produces matter. Therefore this gi . . . similarly, the supreme living entity, Viṣṇu, He has produced this gigantic material cosmic manifestation. He's the root.

ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo
mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate
iti matvā bhajante māṁ
budhā bhāva-samanvitāḥ
(BG 10.8)

Budhā. Those who are intelligent class—budhā means intelligent class, not foolish class—they know, budhā bhāva-samanvitāḥ. This cosmic manifestation is produced by the Supreme Personality of Godhead. That is real knowledge, budhā bhāva-samanvitāḥ. "I am the root."

mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ
sūyate sa-carācaram
(BG 9.10)

Mayādhyakṣeṇa. Just like one man constructs a very big skyscraper building. So this skyscraper building has not produced that man. The man is producing the skyscraper, although the man is very small in the measurement comparison of the skyscraper. The skyscraper—very gigantic. But one who knows where the proprietor goes who has constructed, they saw, "Oh, here is the man who has constructed." "Constructed" means by his money or by his energy. He has not constructed with his hand, but he has spent money, and many other people employ, they have constructed.

Similarly the whole cosmic creation is the man . . . I mean to say, productive, origin, source, is God, is Kṛṣṇa. And by His different energies the cosmic manifestation is coming into existence. That is, that information we get from the Vedas:

parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate
svābhāvikī jñāna-bala-kriyā ca
na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate
na tat-samaś cābhyadhikaś ca dṛśyate
(Śvetāśvatara Upaniṣad 6.8)

These are the information from Vedas, Upaniṣads. Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. God, we . . . we cannot believe Kṛṣṇa is God, because He comes as human being. We cannot accommodate in our tiny brain that how this small boy has created this. This . . . muhyanti yat sūrayaḥ (SB 1.1.1). Just like Brahmā, when Kṛṣṇa was here in Vṛndāvana, Brahmā doubted, "How is that, my Lord, my Master, Kṛṣṇa, is in Vṛndāvana? He's playing with these cowherd boys. How it is possible?" So he played a trick. He took away all the cows and the calves and the cowherd boys, and Kṛṣṇa expanded Himself again.

tābhir ya eva nija-rūpatayā kalābhiḥ
(Bs. 5.37)

That is Kṛṣṇa. He expanded immediately. Because these cowherd boys and calves and cows are stolen by Brahmā– how He go alone in Vṛndāvana village? How the mothers of the cowherd boys will take? Therefore He did not disclose anything, even to Balarāma. He simply expanded Himself in so many cows, calves and cowherds . . . (indistinct) . . . entered Vṛndāvana. You have read this in Kṛṣṇa Book. That is Kṛṣṇa. Ekaṁ bahu-syām. He can expand himself in so many forms also.

advaitam acyutam anādim ananta-rūpam
ādyaṁ purāṇa-puruṣaṁ nava-yauvanaṁ ca
(Bs. 5.33)

He can expand. That is Kṛṣṇa.

So we are also an expansion of Kṛṣṇa. Just like Kṛṣṇa expanded Himself—cowherd boys, calves and cows and everything—similarly He . . . that is His personal energy, internal energy. Similarly, there is external energy. External energy is this material world. That is also Kṛṣṇa's energy. That is not different from Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says:

bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ
khaṁ mano buddhir eva ca
ahaṅkāra itīyaṁ me
bhinnā prakṛtir aṣṭadhā
(BG 7.4)

"These eight kinds of material energy, they are Mine," Me. He says Me. He has expanded Himself by His energy. Therefore one who knows Kṛṣṇa, one who knows the Supreme Brahma, Parambrahma, as Kṛṣṇa, is accepted by Arjuna:

paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma
pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān
(BG 10.12)

One who knows, he's called budhā, a man in knowledge.

So that knowledge is . . . Kṛṣṇa is, Himself, giving us that, "This body is also My energy. And the living entity within the body, that is also My energy, prakṛti."

apareyam itas tu viddhi
prakṛtiṁ parām
(BG 7.5)

Parām prakṛti, jīva-bhūtāṁ. So we should try to understand: this is knowledge, that I am not this body. I am also Kṛṣṇa's energy, expansion of Kṛṣṇa's energy, but I'm superior energy.

apareyam itas tu viddhi
me prakṛtiṁ parām
(BG 7.5)

Aparā, this is . . . this material energy is aparā, inferior quality. Why it is inferior?

jīva-bhūtāṁ mahā-bāho
yayedaṁ dhāryate jagat
(BG 7.5)

The jīva-bhūtā, the living entity, that is controlling over this material energy. Just like we are building skyscraper building. With the skyscraper building they are not coming out itself. The earth is there; the water is there; the brick is there—everything. But they are not coming out itself. The jīva-bhūtāṁ mahā-bāho yayedaṁ dhāryate—because they are touching, they are creating with their brain; therefore it is coming out into . . . (indistinct) . . . otherwise not. This is knowledge.

So now there are two proprietors of the . . . one is . . . just like suppose I am in this room. So proprietor, not occupier. Occupier, there are two kinds of taxes—I do not know there it is in Bombay—owner's tax and occupier's tax. Is it? Is there any two taxes? Municipal taxes?

In Calcutta they have got like that: owner tax and the occupier's tax. Factually that is the position. This room, the owner is different. Owner is Mr. Mahadevia, but we are occupier. Similarly, within this body, within this body, there is owner and the occupier. The owner is the . . . Kṛṣṇa. This body doesn't belong to me; I'm simply occupier. According to my desire, according by activities . . .

Just like, occupier, he wants to rent some apartment, but according to his capacity he'll get an apartment. If he can pay four thousand rent, he'll get good, nice apartment. But if he can pay fifty rupees, then he cannot get a nice apartment. This is an example. So occupier. But the owner is also owner of the fifty-rupees-worth apartment and the four-thousand-worth apartment. Therefore Kṛṣṇa is owner.

bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ
suhṛdaṁ sarva-bhūtānāṁ
(BG 5.29)

Sarva-loka-maheśvaram: Kṛṣṇa is the proprietor. Kṛṣṇa is the proprietor of everything. He is the owner. We are simply occupier. So kṣetra-jña, just like I know about this apartment—where is this room, where is that room, where I have my WC, where I have my kitchen—I know; similarly the proprietor also knows.

It is not that the proprietor does not know. Kṣetra-jñaṁ cāpi māṁ viddhi. So similarly this body, as I know this is my hand, this is my leg, this is my head, similarly Kṛṣṇa also knows. Kṛṣṇa not only knows my hands, my legs, my head, but He knows everyone's heads, legs and everything. Therefore He's called Supersoul.

kṣetra-jñaṁ cāpi māṁ viddhi
sarva-kṣetreṣu bhārata
(BG 13.3)

The landlord knows, as another apartment there may be in this building, but I do not know. But the proprietor of the building, he knows everything. Similarly, I do not know how things are happening within my body—how I am eating, and they're being transformed into different secretion, energies, and distributed in different parts of the body. I do not know, I am simply eating. But Kṛṣṇa knows. Kṛṣṇa knows.

Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, ahaṁ vaiśvānaro bhūtvā, pacāmy annaṁ catur-vidham (BG 15.14). Kṛṣṇa is also helping you in digesting your food. That is also stated. Suppose your digestive power is not working. That means there is something defect. But it can be put into order by Kṛṣṇa. If a man is dying, he can be saved by Kṛṣṇa—not the physician, not the medicine. Because Kṛṣṇa knows everything.

kṣetra-jñaṁ cāpi māṁ viddhi
sarva-kṣetreṣu bhārata
(BG 13.3)

So even for maintaining your body, you have to take help of Kṛṣṇa. You cannot independently maintain your body; that is not possible. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says:

kṣetra-jñaṁ cāpi māṁ viddhi
sarva-kṣetreṣu bhārata
(BG 13.3)

You can take care of your body, but Kṛṣṇa is taking care of everyone's body. Tvad-upekṣitānā. In the Bhāgavata there is a verse, that "My dear Lord," Prahlāda Mahārāja said: "My dear Lord, it is not that because one has got his parents—a child has got his parents—he'll be protected." Bālasya neha śaraṇaṁ pitarau nṛsiṁha (SB 7.9.19). "My dear Lord Nṛsiṁha, it is not that the shelter of a child is the parent. No. Similarly shelter of a patient is not the physician or the medicine. The shelter of a drowning man is not the boat or the big sea."

So we have manufactured so many, I mean to say, shelter, to take shelter of. Just like parent—a child is taking shelter of the parents. A diseased person is taking shelter of the physician. A drowning man is taking shelter of a boat. So Prahlāda Mahārāja says: "All these shelters are actually not shelter. The shelter is Your Lordship. If You neglect somebody, these shelters will not act. This will not give protection."

Actually, tāvad vibho tanu-bhṛtāṁ tvad-upekṣitānām: "If You do not take care of a drowning man, the boat cannot save. If You do not take care of the child, in spite of presence of the parents, the child will not be properly raised. And if You do not take care of a patient, in spite of good physician and doctor, he'll die." This is the point. So Kṛṣṇa is there within the body. Not only I am seeing. I am occupier, and Kṛṣṇa is the owner.

kṣetra-jñaṁ cāpi māṁ viddhi
sarva-kṣetreṣu bhārata
(BG 13.3)

He's the owner. I am proprietor of my body; you are proprietor of your body; but Kṛṣṇa is the proprietor of my body, your body or everyone's body. So the same example: there's a landlord, the proprietor of all the houses here, but I'm the occupier of this particular room only. I've nothing to do with the others. Now one should know, kṣetra-kṣetrajñayor jñānaṁ. This is knowledge.

(aside) Who's making that sound? Stop it.

Kṣetra-kṣetrajñayor jñānaṁ. One should know this soul, the Supersoul, this body. Similarly, one should know what is this material world, the creator, and the occupier. We are living entities. We are simply occupier. But there is a creator. That is God, Kṛṣṇa, and this material world is made of matter.

This is knowledge. Not to mix up that, "Everything has come automatically. There is no God, there is no living entity—this matter is everything." This is all nonsense. But this nonsense, so-called knowledge, nonsensical knowledge, is going on. This is taken as knowledge. The so-called scientists, they have no information.

They're tackling with matter, but they have no knowledge that there is a proprietor, there is an occupier. They do not know. Just like ordinary mason worker, they're building the . . . they're understanding how the building is constructed. But if the mason worker does not know who is the proprietor, who will be the occupier, that means less intelligent.

But the intelligent person should know who has created this material world, this cosmic manifestation; why it is created; what is the relationship between the creator and the occupier; what are the ingredients; how it is created. This is knowledge. This is knowledge. Without this knowledge everyone is fool, rascal. Therefore Kṛṣṇa said:

kṣetra-kṣetrajñayor jñānaṁ
yat jñānaṁ mataṁ
(BG 13.3)

That is knowledge. Don't be falsely proud of so-called knowledge. This is knowledge. Try to understand who is the creator of this universe, why it is created, who are the occupiers, why there are different occupiers, different types of occupiers, 8,400,000's of different forms of life.

Why are they occupying different forms? Why not in the same form? This is knowledge. This is knowledge, but they do not know that there is the occupier, there is a proprietor, the occupier is changing room, from this room to that room, or the soul is transmigrating from one body to another body, and the whole thing is controlled by the proprietor,

sarva-loka-maheśvaram—Śrī Kṛṣṇa, the proprietor of all the planets, all the apartments, all the forms, everything. This is knowledge. This is knowledge. Otherwise one is in ignorance. That is not knowledge. However he may be falsely proud that we are M.A.C., D.H.C., T.H.C.—all nonsense. Because you do not know what is what, who is the proprietor, who is the occupier. That is you do not know. So, next verse.


tat kṣetraṁ yac ca yādṛk ca
yad-vikāri yataś ca yat
sa ca yo yat-prabhāvaś ca
tat samāsena me śṛṇu
(BG 13.4)

Prabhupāda: Yes, that's it.

Devotee: "Now please hear My brief description of this field of activity and how it is constituted, what its changes are, whence it is produced, who that knower of the field of activities is, and what his influences are."

Prabhupāda: Just try to understand that Kṛṣṇa is explaining personally, that tat kṣetraṁ yac ca yādṛk. There are different types of kṣetra, 8,400,000 different type of—the dog's body, the cat's body, the human body, the tree body, the fish body, the demigod body, the insect body, the bird's body.

Why there are different? These are all kṣetra. Tat kṣetraṁ yac ca yādṛk. Why Darwin has tried to explain in a very deceptive and wrong way? Because he has no information of the kṣetra and kṣetrajña. He simply studying the kṣetra, but he has no knowledge of the kṣetrajña. Two kinds of kṣetrajña means the individual livings entity, or the soul, and the Supersoul, Kṛṣṇa. He has no knowledge.

He's simply studying the superficial body. Therefore his knowledge is imperfect. He cannot explain perfectly; he simply says something is missing, but it cannot be adjusted in that way. Here, as Kṛṣṇa said, that tat kṣetraṁ yac ca. How that kṣetra is produced? Yac ca yādṛk, yad-vikāri. How it is transforming? Yad-vikāri yataś ca yat. Wherefrom these things are coming? Where is the orgin? Yataś ca yat. Sa ca yo yat-prabhāvaś ca. How the one body is powerful than the other body. These things are there, but they cannot explain.

Suppose the Darwin's theory says from the monkey the human body is coming. So why from the body of monkey the human body is coming? What is the reason? That he cannot say. He's very faintly studied that from monkey the human body is coming. Then why these changes? That is explained here: yad-vikāri.

Why these changes? Yad-vikāri. That we'll get from Kṛṣṇa, not from the Darwin. Yad-vikāri. Why the monkey's body is changing into human body, or the human body, why it is changing into animal body? That he does not know. He says, "evolutionary theory," that it is being evolved. But it is not guaranteed that simply by gradual process of evolution you come to the human form of body.

But human form body also can be changed. We have got many instances in the śāstras, just like Bharata Mahārāja's body. A king's body, human body . . . (break) (end)