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720616 - Lecture SB 02.03.20 - Los Angeles

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

720616SB-LOS ANGELES - June 16, 1972 - 42:56 Minutes

Pradyumna: Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya. Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya. Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya. On page 155, text number 20. (leads chanting of verse) (Prabhupāda and devotees repeat)

bile batorukrama-vikramān ye
na śṛṇvataḥ karṇa-puṭe narasya
jihvāsatī dārdurikeva sūta
na copagāyaty urugāya-gāthāḥ
(SB 2.3.20)

Prabhupāda: This is a strong "ū." Jihvāsatī dārdurikeva sūta. When there is dīrgha, that should be stressed more. Jihvāsatī dārdurikeva sūta na copagāyaty urugāya-gāthāḥ. Repeat again. (Pradyumna continues leading chanting) Next, anyone. (devotees chant, with Prabhupāda correcting pronunciation) (lady devotee chants)

That's nice. Hmm. Then? Word meaning?

Pradyumna: (leads chanting of synonyms)

bile—snake holes; bata—like; urukrama—the Lord, who acts marvelously; vikramān—prowess; ye—all these; na—never; śṛṇvataḥ—heard; karṇa-puṭe—the earholes; narasya—of the man; jihvā—tongue; asatī—useless; dārdurikā—of the frogs; iva—exactly like that; sūta—O Sūta Gosvāmī; na—never; ca—also; upagāyati—chants loudly; urugāya—worth singing; gāthāḥ—songs. (break)

Translation: "One who has not listened to the messages about the prowess and marvelous acts of the Personality of Godhead and has not sung or chanted loudly the worthy songs about the Lord is to be considered to possess earholes like that of the snakes and a tongue like that of the frogs."

Prabhupāda: Hmm. So the impersonalists or the voidists, so where is their God? So there is no God for them. Impersonal. So there is no activity. What they will hear and where they will chant? If you have no activity, then what shall I hear about you? If you are a dead stone, then what can I hear? Simply one . . . a big stone. That's all. So they have no this opportunity. These impersonalists, they are so unfortunate that they cannot hear. As soon as there is some activity of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, they will say, "It is māyā."

That is called Māyāvāda. "These are . . . our activities, māyā, and therefore God's activities are also māyā." A poor fund of knowledge, or rascaldom. "Because I cannot do this, therefore God cannot do this. I am pleased in this way; therefore God can be . . . permanent, they are identical." Big, big sannyāsī explained like that. "When I am pleased, God is pleased. When I am dissatisfied, God is dissatisfied."

So roundabout way, their philosophy is to satisfy one's own sense gratification. That's all. The Māyāvāda philosophy means, impersonalist means, the same material condition. The material condition means everyone is busy in sense gratification. And therefore they cannot understand. And when there is a question of sense gratification . . . just like, "We are dancing here, ball dance. So this is material māyā. Therefore Kṛṣṇa's dance with the gopīs, that is also māyā." This is Māyāvāda symptom.

The example can be given like this: Just like a patient, since his birth he is sick, and he is lying in the hospital, cannot walk freely or cannot eat nice things. All bitter medicine, injection, always suffering. So if he is informed that, "After your cure, you shall be able to eat nice rasagullā, sandeśa," he cannot believe it. He says: "Again eating? Oh, it is horrible." Because he has got bad experience of eating in sick condition, he thinks that eating in healthy condition is also the same. This is Māyāvāda. He has no experience what is healthy eating. Therefore his bad experience of this diseased condition, he wants to make it zero. He is thinking that, "When my this drinking of medicine and lying down will be zero, oh, that will be my real healthy condition." This is their philosophy.

Because bad experience . . . just like foolish persons sometimes commit suicide or they talk of suicide. The whole thing is zero, wants to make the life zero. That is their happiness. Śūnyavādi. Because they have no experience that there is another life, going back to home, back to Godhead. There also, Kṛṣṇa is eating, Kṛṣṇa is dancing, Kṛṣṇa is playing, Kṛṣṇa is killing. Everything is there. They are all transcendental. Everything is there. Here, only perverted reflection, false reflection only.

There are five principal rasas: śānta, dāsya, sākhya, vātsalya, mādhurya. Here also, the same rasas are here—śānta, dāsya . . . just like I am sitting in this comfortable seat. This is śānta, śānta-rasa. The throne is giving me service in silence. This is called śānta-rasa. Above this, somebody is giving me flower, sandalwood. This is called dāsya-rasa, serving. Better than. This is silent; there is work. The śānta-rasa, dāsya-rasa, then, again develop, sākhya-rasa, more intimate, friendly. Then vātsalya-rasa, more intimate. Just like the parental affection. And more intimate, conjugal love. Just like young boy, young girl, try to love one another.

So these rasas are there, Vṛndāvana. Kṛṣṇa is in love with the gopīs. He is playing with friends, cowherd boys. His affectionate mother, Yaśodā, feeding Him, and there are servants also, serving Kṛṣṇa. And the trees, the water, the flowers, they are serving silently. Pañca-mukhya-rasa, five chief mellows, humors. The same thing is here also. Here also the śānta-rasa, sākhya-rasa, dāsya-rasa is there. But that is mixed with material grains. Just like sweet rice. Sweet rice is very nice, but if it is mixed with some grains of sand, just imagine. How it is pleasurable?

So all the rasas . . . the Māyāvāda philosopher, they have eaten sweet rice with grains, with sand grains. Therefore when you offer him next sweet rice, "Oh, I have got taste. Don't supply it." Or "I wish to live without eating—zero." This is Māyāvāda philosophy, try to understand: impersonal, making everything zero, without any varieties. Nirviśeṣa-śūnyavādi. Nirviśeṣa means without any varieties, and śūnyavādi means zero, voidist. So two kinds of Māyāvādīs, generally headed by Saṅkara philosophy and Buddha philosophy.

But our position is transcendental, above. Karmīs . . . karmīs, they are on the material field. They are trying to enjoy on the material platform. Jñānīs, they are trying to make it variety-less, and the Buddhists, they are trying to make it zero. Our philosophy is substance. This is difference: substance, reality. Vāstava-vastu, real reality, not the false thing.

So these people, the voidists and impersonalists, because they have no information of the Supreme Lord and His activities . . . activities are there. Kṛṣṇa is coming, showing His activity. But they will say: "It is māyā. Kṛṣṇa is māyā." Although Kṛṣṇa is practically showing them that it is not māyā, it is completely spiritual, but their dull brain cannot accommodate that Kṛṣṇa is Supreme Absolute Truth. Therefore the so-called scholars, when Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65)—Kṛṣṇa says: "Just become My devotee, offer your obeisances unto Me, always think of Me," man-manā bhava mad-bhaktaḥ—the scholar, the so-called scholar, says, "This is not to Kṛṣṇa the person. It is to the unborn which is within Him."

The rascal does not know that Kṛṣṇa has no within-without. Kṛṣṇa is absolute. Otherwise there is no meaning of absolute. When there is duality, how it can be absolute? That sense they haven't got. Still, they are passing as big scholar. Kṛṣṇa is no such thing as within and without. We living entities, ordinary living entities . . . I am soul. I am within this body. I am not this body. But Kṛṣṇa is not like that. Kṛṣṇa is both body and soul together. Kṛṣṇa is everything. Kṛṣṇa has no such difference as material and spiritual. For Kṛṣṇa, everything is spiritual. Because material and spiritual, they are two energies only, but they are energy of Kṛṣṇa.

So for Kṛṣṇa, there is no such distinction, material or spiritual. He can convert the material into spiritual and the spiritual into material because He is the original source of these two energies. He is the original source. The same example: just like an expert electrician, he can convert the heater into cooler and the cooler into heater, although they are two opposites, because he knows how to utilize the electrical energy. Similarly, Kṛṣṇa says that, "These material elements, they are also My energy. And the spiritual energy, the jīva-bhūta, they are also My energy." And the whole cosmic manifestation is combination of this material and spiritual energy.

Therefore . . . but Kṛṣṇa is Absolute. He has nothing to do with material or spiritual. Another example can be given: Just like government. Government has got many departments—the criminal department and the educational department. Educational department is giving knowledge to the citizens, and the criminal department is punishing, chastising the citizen. Now, to us, we find difference, that "In this department government is so liberal, is giving education. People are becoming learned, enjoying. And this department . . . so government is discriminating. This department is favorable, and this department is not favorable."

But to the government it is not like that. To the government, both the departments are equal. Rather, sometimes the government has to spend more to the criminal department than to the educational department. Because they have to maintain both these department. To run on the street politically, they have to maintain both these. Similarly, because the individual soul has got little independence, is part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, so Kṛṣṇa has full independence, and we, being part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, we have got that independence quality. How it can be without? Then how can be part and parcel?

The same example—just like a drop of ocean water, it is also salty, the same ingredient. Similarly, we have got little independence. Just like you have taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness out of your independence. There are many other American boys or girls—they are not taking to it. It is not obligatory. But the door is open for everyone. One who is intelligent, he is taking to it. That is due to independence. And some of our boys are also falling back. After remaining few years, again he falls back, again into hodgepodge, you see, due to this misuse of independence.

So because God has given us little independence, therefore there must be two departments: material and spiritual. Otherwise, there is nothing material; everything spiritual. Material is called māyā because those who are in poor fund of knowledge, they cannot see Kṛṣṇa's spiritual energy. They are covered. Therefore they are called Māyāvādī. So the unfortunate Māyāvādī cannot chant. They criticize, "This chanting is sentimentalism."

Even Caitanya Mahāprabhu was criticized at Benares when He was chanting. You know the story. Prakāśānanda Sarasvatī, a great Māyāvāda sannyāsī, he used to criticize that, "This sannyāsī is sentimental. Sannyāsī's business is reading Vedānta, but this sannyāsī is chanting and dancing." So there was strong criticism. Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu was arranged to meet this Māyāvāda sannyāsī, and He talked on Vedānta and He defeated him. And the sannyāsī, along with his 60,000 disciples, became His followers.

So you should not be simply chanting and dancing. Along with, you must know philosophy. There are so many Māyāvādīs; you have to defeat them. It is not that we are coward. We are Kṛṣṇa's soldiers. So as soon as there is Māyāvādī attack, you must immediately defeat him. That is wanted. Therefore so many books are being written. Jñānaṁ ca yad ahaitukam.

vāsudeve bhagavati
bhakti-yogaḥ prayojitaḥ
janayaty āśu vairāgyaṁ
jñānaṁ ca yad ahaitukam
(SB 1.2.7)

If you become pure devotee, this jñāna to defeat this Māyāvāda philosophy will be revealed unto you. Kṛṣṇa is within you. As soon as "He's . . . oh, he is very sincere. He's doing seriously," He will give you all intelligence. Buddhi-yogaṁ dadāmi tam. So . . . but if you are in doubt, "Oh, whether Kṛṣṇa is person or not?" then Kṛṣṇa will not give you intelligence. That is the difficulty. He does not talk with nonsense. He talks, but not with the nonsense. So when you are above the nonsensical platform by sincere service, then Kṛṣṇa will talk with you from within.

(aside) Sit down properly.

So the fact is that "One who has not listened to the messages about the prowess and the marvelous acts of the Personality of Godhead . . ." Now, they have got . . . these Māyāvādīs, they have got their ears, but they cannot hear about the activities of the Lord. They'll reject, "Oh, this is all māyā. Let us meditate." So their these earholes is compared with the snake holes.

When you go, walk on the paddy field, you will find so many holes. Have you got experience? Huh? There are so many holes. Even on the beach, you will find so many holes. But especially in the agricultural field there are holes, because the paddy . . . the rats and mouse, they come to eat the paddies, and they make hole to live there. And the snake take advantage. They enter the hole and eat the rat and mouse and live peacefully.

So these holes, because there are snakes, nobody utilizes it, that hole. Similarly, when these earholes are not receptive of the message of Kṛṣṇa, it is like that, it is not being utilized properly. Similarly, you have got tongue, but you cannot chant Hare Kṛṣṇa—jihvāsatī dārdurikeva: it is just like the tongue of the frogs. The frogs, you have got experience during rainy season, they use their tongue very nicely. They sing ka-kara-kaa, ka-kara-kaa, ka-kara-kaa. (laughter) Yes. But what is the result of singing? The result of singing: in the darkness, the snakes, they can understand, "Here is a frog," and it comes and takes, immediately eats.

Similarly, we have got tongue, and we are lecturing all nonsense things, mental speculation, or singing in the dancing club, "ho-ho, ho-ho," like that. So the result is that we are diminishing our duration of life in that way. The opportunity, the human form of life opportunity, is being uselessly diminished. In the previous verse we have learned, āyur harati vai puṁsām udyann astaṁ ca yann asau (SB 2.3.17). Because the sun's business is to take away your span of life gradually. So same. As the frog is calling his death, the snake, "Please come here, I am here," similarly, these persons who are talking all nonsense without kṛṣṇa-kathā, they are inviting the Yamarāja, "Please come soon. I am here. I am here." This is the position.

So explain.

Pradyumna: Purport: "Devotional service to the Lord is rendered by all limbs or parts of the body. It is the transcendental dynamic force of the spirit soul. Therefore a devotee is engaged one hundred percent in the service of the Lord. One can engage in devotional service when the senses of the body are purified in relation with the Lord. And one can render service to the Lord with the help of all senses. As such, the senses and the action of the senses are to be considered as impure or materialistic as long as they are employed in sense gratification only."

Prabhupāda: The same earholes, you hear some radio message, some materialistic news, some advertisement, so many things you can hear. And in the same earholes, you can hear Hare Kṛṣṇa. So the hearing is there. But when you hear something for your sense gratification, that is material, and when you hear something about Kṛṣṇa, that is spiritual.

This is the difference between material and spiritual. The things are already there. You have got your ears; you have got your tongue; you have got your hand; you have got your leg; you have got your eyes—everything is there. You can utilize it for material purpose and for spiritual purpose. How you can utilize? If you change your consciousness, then you can realize.

So if you change your consciousness to Kṛṣṇa consciousness and utilize the senses for that purpose . . . sarvopādhi-vinirmuktaṁ tat-paratvena nirmalam (CC Madhya 19.170). Just like you are American and I am Indian. We are not concerned about hearing about Indian and America. We have no other business, no more any business. I am not interested hearing about something Indian, and you are also not interested to hear something about American. No. This is called sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam (CC Madhya 19.170). The designation is . . . freed from the designation. Tat-paratvena nirmalam. When we simply hear about Kṛṣṇa, then we are purified.

Hearing . . . the machine is there. People are hearing as American the message of the President or some politics or . . . they are very much interested, "What my country is advancing? How they are killing in Vietnam? How they are doing this, that?" The whole big, big lump of newspaper, you see—for hearing. For hearing. So when one is interested with this big, big lump, lumpy newspaper, for American interest or Indian interest or German interest . . .

Everyone has demarcated: "This is Germany, this is America, this is . . ." Everything belongs to God, and these rascals, they have demarcated, "This is Germany. This is . . ." Īśāvāsyam idam. Kṛṣṇa says, bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva-loka-maheśvaram (BG 5.29). Sarva-loka-maheśvaram: He is the proprietor of all the planets. And in this teeny planet we have made, "Oh, this is America, this is German, this is Japanese." I come as American, live for, say, fifty years or hundred years, and then kicked out, and I become absorbed in the thought of that land.

Yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma ijya-dhīḥ (SB 10.84.13). Bhauma ijya-dhīḥ. I'll live for some years, and because I have got this misconception that, "I am this body," I am worshiping the land, nationalism. What is this land? Does it belong to you? No. Because I have got this designation, title, "I am American," "I am Indian," therefore I am fond of. Just see how much illusory things are going on. I have got a false designation. On account of this designation, I am thinking, "This is mine." This is illusion. Actually, it is God's.

Suppose you are twenty-five years old. Say, before twenty-five years old, where was your country? That you do not know. Might be it was in China or in the hell. You have no knowledge. And now, since twenty-five years you are born in this land, you are absorbed in thought, "This is my country." People are mad after nationalism and fighting. One nation is fighting with another. But these rascals do not know that why they are fighting. The land belongs to God. "You simply fight, and die, and go to hell. That's all." This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

So when people become Kṛṣṇa conscious, this nonsense fighting will stop. Otherwise there is no possibility. Otherwise it is not possible. They are trying to stop fighting by the so-called League of Nation, or United Nation. They are disunited. On principle, they are disunited. So many hundreds of flags, how they can be united? They can be united in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. When they will be really learned, paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ (BG 5.18). Paṇḍitāḥ.

When one is learned . . . just like we are sama-darśinaḥ. We don't discriminate "American," "Indian," "African," "this . . ." We distribute Kṛṣṇa consciousness to everyone. Because we know, "Everyone is part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa. Everyone is son of Kṛṣṇa. They are suffering on account of this material contamination. Let us do something for them." This is wanted. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Otherwise . . . hmm.

Now you can have kīrtana. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Devotees: Jaya. All glories to Śrīla Prabhupāda. (cut) (end)