720614 - Conversation B - Los Angeles

Conversations by Date, 1972

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

720614GC-LOS ANGELES - June 14, 1972 - 18:56 Minutes

(Garden Conversation)

Prabhupāda: . . . opulence, all opulences will be. In the temple, if we accept Kṛṣṇa is present there, all opulences will be . . . if we think that it is idol worship, that is another thing. But, Kṛṣṇa is present here. You should believe like the gopīs, then everything will be . . . (indistinct)

(reading Kṛṣṇa, The Supreme Personality of Godhead, chapter "Songs By the gopīs")

Devotee (1): "Although the lotus flowers are so beautiful, without Your glance they fade away. Similarly, without You we are also dying. Actually, we are neith . . ."

Prabhupāda: Actually, this building, it was a Christian church. Nobody was there. It was a barren desert. And since Kṛṣṇa has come here, you see? The same building. Is it not a fact? The same . . . building is the same, and it was a church, but because there was no Kṛṣṇa, it was a barren land. This is a fact. Nobody was coming; therefore they sold it out: "It is useless." That's a fact. Similarly, everyone can bring Kṛṣṇa at his home by becoming devotee, and there will be opulence.

There will be no question of making suicide out of frustration. So many men, so many actress, so many, out of frustration, committing suicide. They want to die. But if you take Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa consciousness, immediately everything will be clear. That's a fact. Not that Kṛṣṇa was present there and not present here. He is present here. The Deity is present here. But if you think otherwise, then again Kṛṣṇa will be . . . (indistinct) . . . if you think that Kṛṣṇa is personally present here, then everything will be all right.

Devotee (1): (continues reading) "Actually we are neither Your wives or slaves. You never spent any money for us, yet we are simply attracted by Your glance. Now if we die without receiving Your glance, You will be responsible for our deaths. Certainly the killing of women is a great sin, and if You do not come to see us and we die, You will suffer the reactions of sin. So please come see us. Do not think that one can be killed only by certain weapons. We are being killed Your absence. You should consider how You are responsible for killing women. We are always grateful to You, because You have protected us many times . . ."

Prabhupāda: This is the feeling of separation. Such feeling everyone should have.

(aside) Go on.

Devotee (1): ". . . from the poisonous water of Yamunā, from the serpent Kāliya, from Bakāsura, from the anger of Indra and his torrents of rain, from forest fire and so many other incidents. You are the greatest and most powerful of all. It is wonderful for You to protect us from so many dangers. We are surprised You are neglecting us at this moment."

"Dear Kṛṣṇa, dear friend, we know very well that You are not actually the son of Mother Yaśodā or the cowherd man Nanda Mahārāja. You are the Supreme Personality of Godhead and the Supersoul of all living entities. You have, out of Your own causeless mercy, appeared in this world, requested by Lord Brahmā for the protection of the world. It is by Your kindness only that."

"You have appeared in the dynasty of Yadu. O best in the dynasty of Yadu, if anyone afraid of this materialistic way of life takes shelter of Your lotus feet, You never deny him protection. Your movements are sweet, and You are independent, touching the goddess of fortune with one hand, and in the other bearing a lotus flower. That is Your extraordinary feature. Please, therefore, come before us and bless us with the lotus flower in Your hand."

"Dear Kṛṣṇa, You are the killer of all the fears of the inhabitants of Vṛndāvana. You are the supremely powerful hero, and we know that You can kill the unnecessary pride of Your devotee, as well as the pride of women like us, simply by Your beautiful smile."

Prabhupāda: Unnecessary pride is very bad, "Oh, I have become very advanced in Kṛṣṇa consciousness." That we should never think.

Devotee (1): "We are simply Your maidservants and slaves. Please, therefore, accept us by showing us Your lotuslike beautiful face."

"Dear Kṛṣṇa, actually we have become very lusty, having been touched by Your lotus feet. Your lotus feet certainly kill all kinds of sinful activities of devotees who have taken shelter there. You are so kind that even the ordinary animals take shelter under Your lotus feet. Your lotus feet are also the residence of the goddess of fortune, yet You dance on the head of the Kāliya serpent with them. Now we are requesting You to kindly place Your lotus feet on our breasts and pacify our lusty desires to touch You."

"O Lord, Your attractive eyes, like the lotus, are so nice and pleasing. Your sweet words are so fascinating that they please even the greatest scholars, who also become attracted to You. We are also attracted by Your speaking and by the beauty of Your face and eyes. Please, therefore, satisfy us by Your nectarean kisses. Dear Lord, words spoken by You or words describing Your activities are full of nectar, and simply by speaking or hearing Your words one can be saved from the blazing fire of material existence. Great demigods like Lord Brahmā and Lord Śiva are always engaged in chanting the glories of Your words. They do so to eradicate the sinful activities of all living entities in the material world."

"If one simply tries to hear Your transcendental words, he can very quickly be elevated to the platform of pious activities. For the Vaiṣṇavas, Your words give transcendental pleasure, and saintly persons who are engaged in distributing Your transcendental message all over the world are first-class charitable persons.' " This was confirmed by Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī Prabhupāda also, when he addressed Lord Caitanya as the most munificent incarnation because Lord Caitanya distributed the words of Kṛṣṇa and love of Kṛṣṇa free of charge all over the world."

Devotee (2): "'Dear Kṛṣṇa,' the gopīs continued,' You are very cunning. You can imagine how much we are distressed simply by remembering Your cunning smile, Your pleasing glance, Your walking with us in the forest of Vṛndāvana and Your auspicious meditations. Your talks with us in lonely places were heartwarming. Now we are all aggrieved to remember Your behavior. Please save us. Dear Kṛṣṇa, certainly You know how much we are saddened when You go out of Vṛndāvana village to tend the cows in the forest. How we are afflicted simply to think that Your soft lotus feet are being pricked by the dry grass and the tiny stones in the forest! We are so attached to You that we always think simply of Your lotus feet."

"O Kṛṣṇa, when You return from the pasturing ground with the animals, we see Your face covered by Your curly hair and dusted by the hoof dust of the cows. We see Your mildly smiling face, and our desire to enjoy You increases. O dear Kṛṣṇa, You are the supreme lover, and You always give shelter to the surrendered souls. You fulfill everyone's desire; Your lotus feet are worshiped even by Lord Brahmā, the creator of the universe. To whomever worships Your lotus feet, You without a doubt always bestow Your benedictions. So kindly be pleased with us and keep Your lotus feet on our breasts and thus relieve our present distresses. Dear Kṛṣṇa, we are seeking Your kisses, which You offer even to Your flute. The vibration of Your flute enchants the whole world and our hearts also. Kindly, therefore, return and kiss us with Your mouth of nectar."

"When Lord Kṛṣṇa finally reappeared and assembled with the gopīs, He looked very beautiful, just befitting a person with all kinds of opulences. In the Brahma-saṁhitā it is stated, ānanda-cin-maya-rasa-pratibhāvitābhiḥ (Prabhupāda corrects pronunciation): Kṛṣṇa alone is not particularly beautiful, but when His energy—especially His pleasure energy, represented by Rādhārāṇī—expands, He looks very magnificent. The Māyāvāda conception of the perfection of the Absolute Truth—without potency—is due to insufficient knowledge. Actually, outside the exhibition of His different potencies, the Absolute Truth is not complete. Ānanda-cin-maya-rasa means that His body is a transcendental form of eternal bliss and knowledge. Kṛṣṇa is always surrounded by different potencies, and therefore He is perfect and beautiful. We understand from the Brahma-saṁhitā and the Skanda Purāṇa that Kṛṣṇa is always surrounded by many thousands of goddesses of fortune. The gopīs are all goddesses of fortune, and Kṛṣṇa took them hand in hand on the bank of the Yamunā."

"It is said in the Skanda Purāṇa that out of many thousands of gopīs, 16,000 are predominent; out of those 16,000, 108 are especially prominent; out of 108 gopīs, eight gopīs are still more prominent; and out of eight gopīs, Rādhārāṇī and Candrāvalī are prominent; and out of these two gopīs, Rādhārāṇī is the most prominent."

"When Kṛṣṇa entered the forest on the bank of the Yamunā, the moonlight dissipated the surrounding darkness. Due to the season, flowers like the kunda and the kadamba were blooming, and a gentle breeze was carrying their aroma. Due to the aroma, the bees were also flying in the breeze, thinking that the aroma was honey. The gopīs made a seat for Kṛṣṇa by leveling the soft sand and placing cloths over it."

"The gopīs who were gathered there were mostly all followers of the Vedas. In their previous births, during Lord Rāmacandra's advent, they were Vedic scholars who desired the association of Lord Rāmacandra in conjugal love. Rāmacandra gave them the benediction that they would be present for the advent of Lord Kṛṣṇa and He would fulfill their desires. During Kṛṣṇa's advent, the Vedic scholars took birth in the shape of the gopīs in Vṛndāvana; as young gopīs, they got the association of Kṛṣṇa in fulfillment of their previous birth's desire. The ultimate goal of their perfect desire was attained, and they were so joyous that they had nothing further to desire."

"This is confirmed in the Bhagavad-gītā: if one attains the Supreme Personality of Godhead, then he has no desire for anything. When the gopīs had Kṛṣṇa in their company, not only all their grief but their lamenting in the absence of Kṛṣṇa was relieved. They felt they had no desire to be fulfilled. Fully satisfied in the company of Kṛṣṇa, they spread their cloths on the ground. These garments were made of fine linen and smeared with the red kuṅkuma which decorated their breasts. With great care they spread a sitting place for Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa was their life and soul, and they created a very comfortable seat for Him."

"Sitting on a seat amongst the gopīs, Kṛṣṇa became more beautiful. Great yogīs like Lord Śiva, Lord Brahmā or even Lord Śeṣa and others always try to fix their attention upon Kṛṣṇa in their heart, but here the gopīs actually saw Kṛṣṇa seated before them on their cloths."

Prabhupāda: This is yoga. This is yoga system, to see Kṛṣṇa within heart. That is real.

Devotee (2): "In the society of the gopīs, Kṛṣṇa looked very beautiful. They were the most beautiful damsels within the three worlds, and they assembled together around Kṛṣṇa."

"It may be asked herein how Kṛṣṇa seated Himself beside so many gopīs, and yet sat alone. There is a significant word in this verse: īśvara. As it is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānām (BG 18.61). Īśvara refers to the Supreme Lord as the Supersoul seated in everyone's heart. Kṛṣṇa also manifested this potency of expansion as Paramātmā in this gathering with the gopīs. Kṛṣṇa was sitting by the side of each gopī, unseen by the others. Kṛṣṇa was so kind to the gopīs that instead of sitting in their hearts to be appreciated in yogic meditation, He seated Himself by their sides. By seating Himself outside, He showed special favor to the gopīs, who were the selected beauties of all creation."

"Having gotten their most beloved Lord, the gopīs began to please Him by moving their eyebrows and smiling, and also by suppressing their anger. Some of them took His lotus feet in their laps and began to massage them. And while smiling, they confidentially expressed their suppressed anger and said: 'Dear Kṛṣṇa, we are ordinary women of Vṛndāvana, and we do not know much about Vedic knowledge—what is right and what is wrong. We therefore put a question to You, and since You are very learned, You can answer it properly. In dealings between lovers, we find that there are three classes of men. One class simply receives, another class reciprocates favorably, even if the lover is very contrary, and the third class neither acts contrary nor answers favorably in dealings of love. So out of these three classes, which do You prefer, or which do You call honest?"

Devotee (3): "In answer, Kṛṣṇa said: 'My dear friends, persons who simply reciprocate the loving dealings of the other party are just like merchants. They give in loving affairs as much as they get from the other party. Practically there is no question of love. It is simply business dealing, and it is self-interested or self-centered. Better the second class of men, who love in spite of the other party's contrariness. Even those without a tinge of loving affairs are better than the merchants. Sincere love can be seen when the father and mother love their children in spite of their children's neglect. The third class neither reciprocates nor neglects. They can be further divided into two classes. One is the self-satisfied, who does not require anyone's love. They are called ātmārāma, which means they are absorbed in the thought of the Supreme Personality of Godhead and so do not care whether one loves them or not. But another class are ungrateful men. They are called callous. The men in this group revolt against superior persons. For instance, a son, in spite of receiving all kinds of things from loving parents, may be callous and not reciprocate. Those in this class are generally known as guru-druhaḥ, which means they receive favors from the parents or the spiritual master and yet neglect them."

"Kṛṣṇa indirectly answered the questions of the gopīs, even those questions which implied that Kṛṣṇa did not properly receive their dealings. In answer, Kṛṣṇa said that He, as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is self-satisfied. He does not require anyone's love, but at the same time He says that He is not ungrateful."

"'My dear friends,' Kṛṣṇa continued, 'you might be aggrieved by My words and acts, but you must know that sometimes I do not reciprocate My devotees' dealings with Me. It appears that My devotees are very much attached to Me, but sometimes I do not reciprocate their feelings properly in order to increase their love for Me more and more. If I can very easily be approached by them, they might think, "Kṛṣṇa is so easily available." So sometimes I do not respond. If a person has no money but after some time accumulates some wealth and then loses it, he will think of the lost property twenty-four hours a day. Similarly, in order to increase the love of My devotees, sometimes I appear to be lost to them, and instead of forgetting Me, they feel their loving sentiments for Me increase."

"My dear friends, do not think for a moment that I have been dealing with you as I do with ordinary devotees. I know what you are. You have forsaken all kinds of social and religious obligations, you have given up all connection with your parents. Without caring for social convention and religious obligations, you have come to Me and loved Me, and I am so much obliged to you that I cannot treat you as ordinary devotees. Do not think that I was away from you. I was near to you. I was simply seeing how much you were anxious for Me in My absence. So please do not try to find fault in Me. Because you consider Me so dear to you, kindly excuse Me if I have done anything wrong. I cannot repay your continual love for Me, even throughout the lifetimes of the demigods in the heavenly planets. It is impossible to repay you or show gratitude for your love; therefore please be satisfied by your own pious activities. You have displayed exemplary attraction for Me, overcoming the greatest difficulties arising from family connections. Please be satisfied with your highly exemplary character, for it is not possible for Me to repay your debt."

"The exemplary character of devotional service manifested by the devotees of Vṛndāvana is the purest type of devotion. It is enjoined in authoritative śāstra that devotional service must be ahaituka . . ."

Prabhupāda: Ahaituki apratihatā.

Devotee (3): ". . . apratihatā. This means that devotional service to Kṛṣṇa cannot be checked by political or religious convention. The stage of devotional service is always transcendental. The gopīs particularly showed pure devotional service towards Kṛṣṇa, so much so that Kṛṣṇa Himself remained indebted to them. Lord Caitanya thus said that the devotional service manifested by the gopīs in Vṛndāvana excelled all other methods of approaching the Supreme Personality of Godhead."

"Thus ends the Bhaktivedanta purport of the Thirty-first Chapter of Kṛṣṇa, 'Songs by the gopīs.' "

Prabhupāda: That's all. (to someone entering) Come on.

Devotee (3): More?

Prabhupāda: Come on, first . . . (cut) (end)