701211 - Lecture SB 06.01.06 - Indore

Conversations by Date, 1970

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

701211LE-Indore - December 11, 1970 - 49:27 Minutes

Prabhupāda:

na tathā hy aghavān rājan

pūyeta tapa-ādibhiḥ

yathā kṛṣṇārpita-prāṇas

tat-puruṣa-niṣevayā

(SB 6.1.16)

This verse we were discussing last week. So Śukadeva Gosvāmī is affirming, "My dear King, hy aghavān." Hy aghavān means those who are sinful persons. Practically everyone of us who is within this material world more or less we are all sinful. The degrees may be different but nobody is uncontaminated. Simply those who are engaged in the devotional service they are on the prophylactic platform. But that does not mean they are uncontaminated. The devotees they are also contaminated. But they are put into such transcendental platform that further contamination cannot attack them and whatever contaminated life was there in the past that is being counteracted. But don't think for a moment that now we have perfected ourselves. No. We should always bear in mind that we are in the midst of infected area. Any moment the infection can attack us. Take for example that in a neighbourhood where there is infection of disease, say cholera or typhoid like that. Those who have taken vaccines, anti-cholera vaccine or anti-typhoid vaccines. Just like physicians, doctors they go to treat contaminated patient but if they are not cautious the physician will become himself contaminated. Then the question will come out physician heal thyself. A physician goes to treat but he . . . if he is himself a diseased man how he can treat?

So our preachers, our devotees should always remember that māyā is very strong. As soon as there is slackness, immediately māyā will attack. Just like the darkness and sunshine. You'll find in daytime that they are side-by-side. Just on the margin, there is darkness, there is sun, sunshine. So you can remain either in the sunshine or in the darkness that is your choice. But the both things are side-by-side. Similarly Kṛṣṇa and māyā. Māyā has no existence, just like darkness has no existence. Darkness means absence of light that's all. Darkness has no independent existence. Similarly māyā has no independent existence. Māyā means where there is no Kṛṣṇa. That is māyā. The version is given in the Caitanya-caritāmṛta:

kṛṣṇa—sūrya-sama māyā andhakāra

yāhāṅ kṛṣṇa, tāhāṅ nāhi māyāra adhikāra

(CC Madhya 22.31)

Just like this room, is now illuminating, lighted. We just put off the switch, immediately it becomes dark. So the darkness we haven't got to call it a creation. This . . . immediately there is no light there is darkness. So immediately you are out of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, immediately there is māyā. It is not that I'll have to call māyā, "Please come." She is already here, simply as soon as you are forgetful of Kṛṣṇa. She is present. Therefore here it is said:

na tathā hy aghavān rājan

pūyeta tapa-ādibhiḥ

My dear King, these people who are in this material world they are all in darkness. That's a fact. Without being sinful nobody comes into this material world. Either he may be Brahmā or an insignificant ant. Brahmā is the most important personality or creature within this universe. An ant or insect nobody cares for it. You see? But both of them are the same living entity. That small spark. An elephant, gigantic body and an insect has minute body. Even you have to see with the microscope, you can't see with naked eyes. Both of them are living entities and both of them have the same spiritual spark. That is measured, I have several times explained. The measurement of spirit soul is there in the śāstras. That is one ten thousandth part of the tip of your hair. So you have no knowledge or instrument how to see that minute particle of soul. But there is measurement. There is measurement it is in the śāstra. So that smallest particle, part and parcel of God is in everyone of us. That is not born, that is there always existing. Na jāyate mriyate vā (BG 2.20).

That particle, smallest particle soul never takes birth, neither dies. That is eternal. But the death—birth and death is of different kinds of body. Designation, it is in the śāstra it is called—upādhiḥ. Upādhiḥ, just like you have got an American designation due to the body. You are thinking, "I am American." Why you are thinking American? Because you have got this birth of this body in America. That's all. Similarly I am thinking of India because this body is made in India. That's all. But so far the spirit soul is concerned it is the same. It is the same. So this body we get within this material world according to pious or impious activities. Those who are very pious . . . pious means in this sense; in the worldly sense, morality. This is considered as morality, charity. There are many other things, pious atribute, tapasya—austerities, penance, meditation; so many. To be hygienic, that is also pious activity. To be cleansed, bahyābhyantaraṁ, Outside inside. These are all pious activities.

So by pious activities you can get yourself elevated to different higher standard of life, that's all. But you cannot get out of the clutches of these four principles of material existence. Namely birth, death, old age and disease. That is not possible. And our whole process is, how to get out of this material entanglement. That is intelligence. The pious activity, those who are undergoing various types of pious activities. They can get their next life in the Brahmaloka just like Brahmā. You cannot calculate even his one days duration of life. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā. Or in other planets, you can get ten thousands of years duration of life. Actually from Vedic literature we understand that in the moon planet, there are living entities whose life is ten thousands of years. And their one day equal to our six months. Such ten thousand years.

So these kind of life we can get by pious activities but the pious activities may diminish also. Just like you have got very good bank balance, say 10,000 millions of dollars you have got. But that does not mean that balance will not decrease. At any moment the balance may come to the point of zero and your condition is again the same zero. The bank balance is finished and you are a pauper. Similarly the action of your pious activities finished then again you are the same. It is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā: kṣīṇe puṇye punaḥmartya-lokaṁ viśanti (BG 9.21).

As, as soon as the result of your pious activities are finished you are again put into this lower planetary system. Just like your immigration department in order to admit a foreigner as permanent resident. There is so many enquiries and the most important enquiry is that, "How you shall live here? How much bank balance you have got and who will provide for you?" They want to be satisfied in this point first. So as soon as the immigration department sees that your bank balance is nil and nobody is providing. Then immediately they will ask, "Please get out." (laughs) "Please get out—immediately." The same thing. You go to the higher planet but the strength of your pious activities as soon as it is finished you will be asked, "Please get out."

So these are not very safe place. That if you want to go to the higher standard of life that is material propensities. Everyone is trying to have higher standard of life. That is called civilization or that is called perfection of life. No. Your higher standard of life means to live for some more days or have some facilities for sense gratification. But that is not out of sinful life. No.

Real higher standard of life is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That you have to understand. Without Kṛṣṇa consciousness everyone is sinful. Everyone. Therefore here it is said hy aghavān, hy aghavān means sinful. So he recommends, "My dear King the sinful man cannot get out of the reaction by so-called austerities, meditation, purification or truthfulness and controlling the senses, controlling the mind. There is so many. They cannot come to the perfection then stay it. Simplify. Simply by undergoing these processes it is not possible. It is not that they are not making progress. They are making progress but it is not so much perfect. How? Kṛṣṇārpita, yathā kṛṣṇārpita-prāṇas. A person who has dedicated his life to Kṛṣṇa, yathā kṛṣṇārpita-prāṇas tat-puruṣa-niṣevayā. And one has engaged himself in devotional service 24 hours, cent percent without any deviation. Nobody can be compared with that person. He may practice austerities, penances, yogic practice or pious activities, majorities There so many nice things. But a still all of them combined together cannot be equal to the person who has dedicated his life to Kṛṣṇa. This is clearly said. Then again it is says:

sadhrīcīno hy ayaṁ loke

panthāḥ kṣemo 'kuto-bhayaḥ

(SB 6.1.17)

"Therefore my dear King if you want guaranteed progress of life without any faith . . ."

(pause)

Hm . . . samitian sadhrīcīnaḥ means—this is the considered opinion of the Vedic knowledge. Sadhrīcīnaḥ, samīcīnaḥ. Just like if you do something and if I say: "It is right, yes." That is confirmation, "Yes." Then it is right. Similarly, if one has taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So Śukadeva Gosvāmī says this is the right path. Sadhrīcīnaḥ.

sadhrīcīno hy ayaṁ loke

panthāḥ kṣemo 'kuto-bhayaḥ

(SB 6.1.17)

Kṣemaḥ—protection. Protection. It is the same thing. Prophylactic measure. If you are taken all the injection prophylactic measures then even if you move in the contaminated area. You are not affected. So Śukadeva Gosvāmī recommends, kṣemaḥ. Kṣemaḥ means—auspicioucity.

Yataḥkṣemaḥ, kṣematve hetuḥ, na kutaścid vighnāder bhayaṁ (Bhāvārtha-dīpikā, 6.1.17). Śrīdhara Svāmī explains kṣemaḥ. Kṣemaḥ means—full security. Na vighnāder bhayaṁ. Now suppose you are going to do something. There may be so many hindrances but this path. This Kṛṣṇa consciousness is so nice that that is no fear of any hindrance. If you strictly follow the principles. This . . . why not follow strictly? It is very simple. Chant Hare Krishna mantra. Because in the beginning we have no attachment for Hare Krishna mantra therefore the stricture is that you must chant so many beads. So, so long we haven't got natural aptitude, natural affection for chanting Hare Krishna. We must follow these rules. But when you actually become experienced and advanced in Kṛṣṇa consciousness then for a moment you cannot remain without chanting Hare Krishna. But so long we don't come to that stage we must strictly follow to chant the 16 rounds. Then, māyā is there. She is always looking for the opportunity. "When I shall grab this . . . he is trying to get out of my clutches."

So just like somebody is paying interest, so the loan giver wants that he go on giving. Just like bank, they . . . they are advertising in so many ways. "That please come and take loan from us and pay us interest." That is their business. The American card, this MasterCard, this card. So many alluration there. "Oh you take loan for decorating your home, you take loan for riding a motor car, you take loan for this and that. They are offering. Their only business is that as soon as he comes, "Oh 8%, 10%. Come on." (laughter). So their business is 10%. Similarly māyā she does not like that we shall get out of her clutches. She is always making plan, how to keep us. Under her clutches. It is certified by Lord Kṛṣṇa Himself, he says: daivī hy eṣā guṇa-mayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14).

Duratyayā means—very, very difficult to get out of the clutches of My māyā. This māyā is Kṛṣṇa's māyā. Just like the criminal department is also government's department. Government has equal attention to the criminal department, similarly māyā is also Kṛṣṇa's māyā. Nobody is out of Kṛṣṇa's clutches. So therefore the theory that Kṛṣṇa when He comes, He also becomes under the control of māyā. That is a nonsense theory. No. Kṛṣṇa does not become under the control of māyā. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, Kṛṣṇa says: sambhavāmy ātma-māyayā (BG 4.6).

He is not forced to come here. We are forced to accept something. I have been forced to accept a certain type body. You have been forced to accept certain type of body. But Kṛṣṇa is not that. Kṛṣṇa does not accept a body forced upon him by māyā. Then you'll mistake. Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is stated that: avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā (BG 9.11).

"The fools and rascals they deride at Me," that Kṛṣṇa is also like one of us. "He may be very learned, very powerful, or very beautiful but he is also one of the human beings." No. He is not one of the human beings. So you should study Bhagavad-gītā very critically.

How He is not human body? That is also explained in the Bhagavad-gītā, you know in the fourth chapter. Kṛṣṇa says that, "I taught this lesson of Bhagavad-gītā millions of years ago to the sun god." Now Arjuna questioned, these are very intelligent part of Bhagavad-gītā. That, "Kṛṣṇa you are my cousin brother, our age is practically the same, how is that. I shall believe that You taught millions of years ago the sun god?" Arjuna knew perfectly well that Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, what He says is all right. But because we shall misunderstand Kṛṣṇa, therefore he puts this question. "What is that Kṛṣṇa?" Question. He says: "My dear Kṛṣṇa, oh the sun god Vivasvān he was born long, long years ago and You are born just along with me. How I can believe that You taught?" So the answer was, Kṛṣṇa's, "Yes although it is millions and millions of years ago and you were also with Me. Because you are My eternal friend. So it is to be understood you were also at that time present. But you have forgotten, I have not forgotten. That is the difference. Kṛṣṇa says, "Both you and Me we had many, many births but you have forgotten them. I do not forget."

In another place Kṛṣṇa says: vedāhaṁsamatītāni (BG 7.26).

"I know everything, past present and future. But nobody knows Me."

So you have to study Bhagavad-gītā in this way. Then you will understand. So anyone, who has got this material body. This material body means, it is an encagement for suffering. That's all. So do not think that we are free from this material contamination. But so long you are in Kṛṣṇa consciousness fully then these contamination cannot touch you. You are in the midst of contamination but if you inject yourself with Kṛṣṇa consciousness and keep yourself what is called prophylactic or antiseptic then these contamination cannot touch you. Kṛṣṇa also says in the Bhagavad-gītā:

mām eva ye prapadyante

māyām etāṁ taranti te

(BG 7.14)

"Māyā is very difficult, that's a fact but anyone who has surrendered unto Me, oh he can surpass the control of māyā." The same thing is confirmed here by Śukadeva Gosvāmī that one who has dedicated his life, prāṇaḥ. Prāṇaḥ means—life. Kṛṣṇa-arpita. Simply surrender. "Kṛṣṇa from this day I am Yours." That's all. "I was forgetful of You for many, many births now by Your kindness by Your grace I understand that You are the supreme." This knowledge comes after many, many births. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante (BG 7.19).

These speculators are speculating what is the ultimate goal of life. After such speculation of many, many births when one is actually wise he surrenders to Kṛṣṇa. And as soon as he surrenders to Kṛṣṇa he becomes unaffected by the contamination of māyā. This is the process. Kṛṣṇa-arpita mano. No, nothing to think except Kṛṣṇa. We have got therefore so many engagements from morning, four o'clock upto 10 o'clock. Why so many engagements? Why not make here . . . make . . . make it a plan? That once in a week let us go and become Kṛṣṇa conscious. No. You should become Kṛṣṇa conscious 24 hours then it is possible that māyā will not touch you. If you make it official programme, that all right along with other business I shall meditate upon Kṛṣṇa for half an hour. 15 minutes. For that 15 minutes of course you are uncontaminated but if you, other 24 hours you engage then it is māyā. Then what is it? If you burn a matchstick and pour upon it three gallons of water. Oh, how it will burn? (Laughter). You see? It is useless. Waste of time. You must burn the stick, matchstick and get it more and more blazing. That should be your business. Not that I do it for a moment and pour water. This useless waste of time. So Śukadeva Gosvāmī recommends that:

sadhrīcīno hy ayaṁ loke

panthāḥ kṣemo 'kuto-bhayaṁ

(SB 6.1.17)

Akutaḥ-bhayaṁ means—there is no risk. The same thing is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā also, ninth chapter. The Lord says that, su-sukhaṁ kartum avyayam (BG 9.2).

These process, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness is so nice. It is the easiest process. Now to remain always in contact with Kṛṣṇa is our program. And somehow even sleeping, one has to have think of Kṛṣṇa. If one has to rise early in the morning, then while sleeping he is also very alert. "So I must have to rise, I have to awaken Kṛṣṇa." So that means in sleeping he is also thinking of Kṛṣṇa. You see? Then after ārati he takes care of the temple room and Kṛṣṇa seeings then after further encagement, further encagement, further encagement, in this way up to 10 or 11 or 12. If you keep yourself—then it is very nice. To māyā is awake and all these hours māyā is awake. Therefore this path is recommended, it is accepted by all sages, all saintly person. Ārādhito yadi haris tapasā tataḥ kim (Nārada-pañcarātra 1.2.6).

If you are worshipper or devotee of Hari the Supreme Personality of Godhead there is no more necessity of any kind of austerity. And Kṛṣṇa says, su-sukhaṁ kartum avyayam (BG 9.2). These, I mean to say, engagement is very pleasurable. Pleasurable, what is the difficulty? Here the boys are simply chanting and dancing and eating prasādam. What is the difficulty here? Such a nice temple, neat and clean and they are dancing. They are eating, they are chanting, they are enjoying. So, su-sukhaṁ. Su-sukhaṁ mane (means) every part of this engagement is pleasurable. By pleasurable. These transcendental intoxication is so nice. (laughter). That you don't have to take, I mean to pleasure by LSD or wine or this or that. (laughter). It is automatically transcendentally, ah what is called? Intoxication. So come to this intoxication and your life will be saved. This is our propaganda we invite everyone without any distinction. There is no distinction Kṛṣṇa is for everyone and practically you see. These boys and girls from their childhood they were not trained in this life, neither they had any qualification but how nice they are becoming. Anyone, any sane man can understand it.

One lady reporter in Philadelphia, he was, she was surprised. She asked: "Are you American? Are you American boys?" "Yes." So, su-sukhaṁ, kartum avyayam. And the . . . as much as you be advanced that is your secured. Kṛṣṇa consciousness, if you cannot even execute cent percent, any person, one person, two person, three person, ten person, anyone. Up to 99.9%. Whatever you do that is your permanent asset. It will never be, I mean destroyed. Just as you are spirit soul you are never destroyed. Similarly your spiritual activities will never be destroyed. Abhayam. It is called abhayam. Indestructible. Therefore this is the safest way of self-realisation. That is recommended here. So:

suśīlāḥ sādhavo yatra

nārāyaṇa-parāyaṇāḥ

(SB 6.1.17)

And what is the evidence? Just see how the words of Bhāgavata are valuable. That anyone you find actually gentle, good behaviour. He is a devotee, he must be a devotee. Otherwise we cannot be gentle and good behaviour.

One postmaster in India when I was. I went to see him in connection with my Back to Godhead there. So he asked me . . . at that time I was not sannyāsī, I was householder, or retired up. I retired from household life. He said: "Gosvāmījī, if somebody is honest, moral and pious then does he require to be God conscious again?" I replied immediately, "Unless one is God conscious he cannot be honest, he cannot be pious, he cannot be gentle."

Devotees: Jaya! Jaya! Jaya! Jaya! Prabhupada.

Prabhupāda: He cannot be. He was stopped. This is the only means that one can be gentle, one can be good behaved, one can be pious. Unless one is Kṛṣṇa conscious he cannot, simply by law, or by training, by this. I do not wish to name. So we are sometimes talks with learned scholars. They can quote from many books but so far their character is concerned it is most abominable.

Devotees: Jaya! Hare Krishna.

Prabhupāda: I do not wish to name there. They are sometimes doctor, this or that. But see their character, private life is most abominable. Therefore it is a fact, that these. I mean to say qualification to become moral, to become gentle. That is not possible, nobody. I give you. I can give you so many examples. I think I shall give you one good example. That in our country you have heard the name of Mahatma Gandhi. So sometimes back when there was political upheaval. So Mahatma Gandhi, designated, nominated some of his disciple that next year he should be president. But public by votes, another—Subash Candra Bose he was elected president. So Gandhi he was so angry that he did not attend the Congress meeting. He went away. Now see—these are to be studied. He was actually a very good man Mahatma but this is not gentlemenlyness. He should have accepted when public has elected the other man as president. Why shall I interfere with it? Is it not against gentlemen's principle? Well I . . . I nominated somebody that he should be president but public did not like him. There . . . elected somebody else, so why shall I interfere with that? That is not gentlemanlyness. If you depend on public vote then whatever public has elected you have to accept it. That is gentlemanlyness. So in the. My point is that in the material world actually perfectly nobody can be gentlemen unless he is Kṛṣṇa conscious. Suśīlāḥ, he says, suśīlāḥ. Suśīlāḥ means—good behaviour. And sādhavaḥ means—honest. Good behaved, honest, you'll find everyone actually who he is good behaved and honest he must be a devotee of Lord. Nārāyaṇa parāḥ.

suśīlāḥ sādhavo yatra

nārāyaṇa-parāyaṇāḥ

(SB 6.1.17)

So therefore it is the duty of every state if the state wants actually the citizens to be honest and to be pious, good behaved. They should introduce this Krishna Consciousness Movement. That is practical suggestion. But unfortunately they are trying to prosecute our poor devotees. Because they are so kind, going to the street, chanting this Hare Krishna mantra and purifying the whole area. Therefore they should be stopped. You see? This is called Kali-yuga. Sacha bole to māre latha (Vaisnava verse book by Rohininanda p51, Hindi proverb) If you speak the truth then people will be angry and if you cheat them they will be very much pleased.

Devotees: (laughter) Jaya!

Prabhupāda: You see? Because I say that unless you become Kṛṣṇa conscious you have no qualification. That people will say Swamiji is very rigid and conservative. He does not give any credit to others. But that's a fact. How can I give? Here in the śāstra it is said, just see practical by practical examples. In your country so many Svāmī's, so many yogīs came. Find out any student of such yogīs and Svāmī's comparable with my students. That is my challenge. So how can you say, that there can't be anything good beyond Kṛṣṇa consciousness? There is no possibility.

So this is also confirmed here that:

sādhavo suśīlāḥ yatra

nārāyaṇa-parāyaṇāḥ

(SB 6.1.17)

Prāyaścittāni cīrṇāni (SB 6.1.18). Again he is speaking from the opposite side. What is that?

prāyaścittāni cīrṇāni

nārāyaṇa-parāṅmukham

na niṣpunanti rājendra

surā-kumbham ivāpagāḥ

(SB 6.1.18)

In our country, not our country, our country has gone to hell and other things. Those who are Kṛṣṇa conscious, those who are following the Vedic principles according to them a one drop of wine pollutes the whole thing. Oh. The example is given that if you have got a bucket full of milk and drop on it one drop of wine. It is immediately becomes useless. It cannot be touched. So here this example is being given but it is definitely difficult to understand. Here it is said that:

prāyaścittāni cīrṇāni

nārāyaṇa-parāṅmukham

(SB 6.1.18)

Any atonement for counteracting sinful life but without being Kṛṣṇa consciousness is just like to wash a pot which contains wine by water. That means a pot which contains wine if you want to cleans it. It is not possible it is to be thrown away. It is not to be cleansed. Oh. It is to be thrown away. So you can undergo many kinds of austerities, mystic yoga's, or this or that. But ultimately if you are Godless, if you have no God consciousness, it is useless. Oh śrama hi eva kevalam (SB 1.2.8). Simply uselessly wasting time. That's a fact.

prāyaścittāni cīrṇāni

nārāyaṇa-parāṅmukham

na niṣpunanti rājendra

surā-kumbham ivāpagāḥ

(SB 6.1.18)

Just like you cannot cleanse the wine pot by washing it with any amount of water. It is not possible, it never becomes purified. Similarly persons who are nārāyaṇa-parāṅmukham, who are aversed to God consciousness or Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Their austerities, penances, mystic powers, this or that. They are useless, they cannot be purified exactly. That's a fact. Huh, then he says:

sakṛn manaḥ kṛṣṇa-padāravindayor

niveśitaṁ tad-guṇa-rāgi yair iha

na te yamaṁ pāśa-bhṛtaś ca tad-bhaṭān

svapne 'pi paśyanti hi cīrṇa-niṣkṛtāḥ

(SB 6.1.19)

Now he says further, sakṛn manaḥ kṛṣṇa-padāravindayor, kṛṣṇa-padāravindayor. Upon the lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa. One who has given his mind at least for some time.

sakṛn manaḥ kṛṣṇa-padāravindayor

niveśitaṁ tad-guṇa-rāgi yair iha

And somehow or other once one has become attracted by the transcendental attributes of Kṛṣṇa. For in once, once only. Even not whole life. Sometimes if he has become, then what is the result? Na te yamaṁ pāśa-bhṛtaś ca tad-bhaṭān. It is guaranteed for him that the Yamarāja will never send his messenger to take him there. Svapne 'pi paśyanti hi cīrṇa-niṣkṛtāḥ. They will not even dream, that I have to go and bring that man for punishment here . . . (indistinct) . . . in India, somebody, anyway long ago, somebody asked me. At that time I was . . . (indistinct) . . . so, "What is this?" So I told, "This is . . ." What is called? A dog's . . . eh? Collar.

Devotee: Collar.

Prabhupāda: Collar.

Mātājī: A collar.

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is the collar of the dog. (laughs). If Yamarāja is trying to find out a dog without collar for shooting. So if you put this Yamarāja will not shoot you.

Devotees: (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Because he will understand this collar is given by Kṛṣṇa. So he is pet dog or pet animal of Kṛṣṇa.

Mātājī: Haribol.

Prabhupāda: So he is not to be touched.

Mātājī: Jaya . . . (laughs)

Prabhupāda: So next week we shall recite a story about Ajāmila. How he was saved by slight Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And this is an example. Very nice. Thank you very much. (end)