Collaborate with us to invoke and fully manifest Srila Prabhupada's Vani-presence.
680614 - Lecture BG 04.08 - Montreal
(indistinct background talk amongst devotees)
Lady devotee: (aside to other devotee) You have that extension cord?
Devotee (1): I didn't understand something in here. I was wondering if you could explain it for me. Can I just... Just this paragraph. This one paragraph.
Prabhupāda: Which one?
Devotee (1): This paragraph. It's a long, long world(?), all about completes, small and complete within the large complete. "Small completes exist in the whole complete, while complete (indistinct)."
Prabhupāda: We are small complete.
(break) Janārdana is not here?
Devotee (2): No, he said he couldn't come tonight. He has a kind of a job tonight. He's playing in a band.
Prabhupāda: (sings maṅgalācaraṇa prayers) (kīrtana)
- vande 'haṁ śrī-guroḥ śrī-yuta-pada-kamalaṁ śrī-gurūn vaiṣṇavāṁś ca
- śrī-rūpaṁ sāgrajātaṁ saha-gaṇa-raghunāthānvitaṁ taṁ sa-jīvam
- sādvaitaṁ sāvadhūtaṁ parijana-sahitaṁ kṛṣṇa-caitanya-devaṁ
- śrī-rādhā-kṛṣṇa-pādān saha-gaṇa-lalitā-śrī-viśākhānvitāṁś ca
- nama oṁ viṣṇu-pādāya kṛṣṇa-preṣṭhāya bhū-tale
- śrīmate bhaktisiddhānta-sarasvatīti nāmine
- śrī-vārṣabhānavī-devī-dayitāya kṛpābdhaye
- kṛṣṇa-sambandha-vijñāna-dāyine prabhave namaḥ
- śrī-gaura-karuṇā-śakti-vigrahāya namo 'stu te
- namas te gaura-vāṇī-śrī-mūrtaye dīna-tāriṇe
- namo gaura-kiśorāya sākṣād-vairāgya-mūrtaye
- vipralambha-rasāmbhodhe pādāmbujāya te namaḥ
- namo bhaktivinodāya sac-cid-ānanda-nāmine
- gaura-śakti-svarūpāya rūpānuga-varāya te
- gaurāvirbhāva-bhūmes tvaṁ nirdeṣṭā saj-jana-priyaḥ
- vaiṣṇava-sārvabhaumaḥ śrī-jagannāthāya te namaḥ
- vāñchā-kalpatarubhyaś ca kṛpā-sindhubhya eva ca
- patitānāṁ pāvenebhyo vaiṣṇavebhyo namo namaḥ
- namo mahā-vadānyāya kṛṣṇa-prema-pradāya te
- kṛṣṇāya kṛṣṇa-caitanya-nāmne gaura-tviṣe namaḥ
- pañca-tattvātmakaṁ kṛṣṇaṁ bhakta-rūpa-svarūpakam
- bhaktāvatāraṁ bhaktākhyaṁ namāmi bhakta-śaktikam
- he kṛṣṇa karuṇā-sindho dīna-bandho jagat-pate
- gopeśa gopikā-kānta rādhā-kānta namo 'stu te
- jayatāṁ suratau paṅgor mama manda-mater gatī
- mat-sarvasva-padāmbhojau rādhā-madana-mohanau
- (Sambandhādhideva Praṇāma)
- preṣṭhālībhiḥ sevyamānau smarāmi
- (Abhidheyādhideva Praṇāma)
- śrīmān rāsa-rasārambhī vaṁśī-vaṭa-taṭa-sthitaḥ
- karṣan veṇu-svanair gopīr gopīnāthaḥ śriye 'stu naḥ
- (Prayojanādhideva Praṇāma)
- rādhe vṛndāvaneśvari
- vṛṣabhānu-sute devi
- praṇamāmi hari-priye
- hare kṛṣṇa hare kṛṣṇa kṛṣṇa kṛṣṇa hare hare
- hare rāma hare rāma rāma rāma hare hare
(prema-dhvani) (devotees offer obeisances)
Prabhupāda: Why he is sitting there? Come. Come here.
- oṁ ajñāna-timirāndhasya
- cakṣur-unmīlitaṁ yena...
- ...tasmai śrī-gurave namaḥ
- sthāpitaṁ yena bhū-tale
- svayaṁ rūpaḥ kadā mahyaṁ
- dadāti sva-padāntikam
- paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ
- vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām
- sambhavāmi yuge yuge
- (BG 4.8)
This verse we have been discussing, that the Lord descends out of His own spiritual energy. He descends, appears, yuge yuge sambhavāmi, in every millennium. And dharma-saṁsthāpanārthāya. Two things are visible in His characteristics. One thing is paritrāṇāya sādhūnām. Those who are pious, following strictly the rules and regulation of particular type of scripture, to protect such persons, and to vanquish duṣkṛtām, miscreants.
Miscreants... Who are miscreants? Miscreants, means just like outlaw. A person may be very nice, well-educated or wealth. So many qualification he might have. But if he is an outlaw, then all his qualification becomes damned. Similarly, duṣkṛtām, miscreants, outlaw, those who are not obedient to the laws of nature or laws of God.
There is no difference between laws of nature and laws of God. Laws of nature means laws of God. Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). Therefore Bhāgavata says that religious principle cannot be manufactured by any human being. It is the law of God. Therefore one has to obey it. One cannot disobey. Law of nature you cannot disobey. It will be enforced upon you. Just like law of nature, the winter season. You cannot change it. It will be enforced upon you. Law of nature, summer season, you cannot change it, anything. Laws of nature or laws of God, the sun is rising from the eastern side and setting on the western side. You cannot change it, anything. That you have to understand, how laws of nature is going on.
That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness, to understand laws of nature. And as soon as speak of laws of nature, we must accept that there is a law maker. Laws of nature cannot develop automatically. There must be some authority on the background. Bhagavad-gītā therefore says in the Tenth Chapter that mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10): "Under My direction, superintendence, the material laws are working."
The scientist, they are studying material laws, but they have no information of the law maker. They are surprised with the wonderful laws. Now, you can study your own body, how laws of nature is working under the direction of a living entity. You just try to understand your own body.
You are eating, it is going to the stomach, and it is transforming into different secretion. Then it is pumped up to the heart. And in the heart it becomes reddish, blood, and the blood is transfused or transported to different parts of the body through the veins. There is a big mechanical arrangement undoubtedly. Every scientist or every sane man will admit.
But it is just like a machine. It is just like a machine. Any machine you take—motorcar, typewriting, whatever you have got experience... There are many in your country; it is machine country. So the constructor..., construction of the machine may be very complicated, wonderful, very nice, everything is all right, but a living entity required to pull on the button.
Without pulling on the button, however nice arrangement may be in the machine, it cannot work. That is our experience. We cannot deny it. The wonderful machine, working... Now, business machine, there are so many wonderful machine, they are working also. Sometimes calculating brain is required; electrical brain is there. Everything is all right. But unless a man puts on the button, press the button, it cannot work. That thing is important.
Similarly, the statement of Bhagavad-gītā, that mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10), this material world, this cosmic manifestation, is working very wonderfully, and controlling the moving and the not-moving. We have got experience. Just like we are moving, man, animal. But there are certain other things, just like trees, mountain, they do not move. So moving or unmoving. But everyone is being controlled by the laws of nature.
Carācaram. Cara means moving; acaram means not moving. Hetunānena kaunteya: "Because I am on the background," kaunteya, "My dear Arjuna, for this reason..." Hetunānena kaunteya.
- mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ
- sūyate sa-carācaram
- hetunānena kaunteya
- jagad viparivartate
- (BG 9.10)
Jagat, the progressive world, is parivartate, changing. In so many ways they are changing. This is a fact.
Now how you can deny the living force behind this gigantic mechanical arrangement? Call it material world, material machine or whatever you may call. How you can deny? At least from your practical experience you cannot deny. You may put some jugglery of words, but the actual fact is this.
So duṣkṛtina means a person who does not believe in this. They are called miscreants. Paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām (BG 4.8). So God, in His incarnation, appears with two missionary purposes. One purpose is paritrāṇāya sādhūnām, just to protect the pious who are obedient to the laws of God, or the laws of nature; and to vanquish persons who are disobedient. They are called duṣkṛtina.
This duṣkṛtina, or miscreant, is described in another place also in the Bhagavad-gītā: na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). The purport is, Kṛṣṇa says, that those who are miscreants, always disobeying the laws of nature or always denying the prime factor behind the wonderful activities of nature, such miscreants, na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ (BG 7.15). Mūḍhāḥ means they are rascals. They cannot... They will put so many theories that "There is no God," and none of the theories are practical, neither they can prove it by experimental knowledge. Still, they will insist on. That is their business. And when we say... When somebody says, "You prove it," the answer is, "Well, we are advancing. Some day will come, we shall prove it." That's all. "Some day will come."
They do not understand that "Trust no future, however pleasant." Why you are expecting that some day will come when science will be perfect? Throughout the whole history of the human society, never it has been possible that one can give life. There is no such instance in the history. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). The four principles of material inebrieties, namely birth, death, old age and disease, nobody has been able to check it in the past history of human society, and how you can believe that in future these problems, namely janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi, birth, death, old age and disease, will be solved by the advancement of science? So at least we cannot believe. And no sane man will believe it.
Therefore those who are trying to defy the presence of God, saying, "God is dead," "There is no God," and trying to prove by so-called scientific method there is no God, the matter is working out of his own way, and things are taking place—there are so many theories—they are all classified as miscreant. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ. Miscreants, and mūḍhāḥ, means rascal.
Mūḍha... Real meaning of mūḍha is ass. Ass has no knowledge. He is working day and night, or very... But he does not know what for he is working. He has no ambition; he has no information where is the destination of perfection. Therefore they are called mūḍhāḥ. Mūḍhāḥ means rascal. So na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). Narādhama means lowest of the mankind. Na prapadyante: "They do not surrender unto Me, God." Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ.
Now the question may be that "Why they do not surrender? Why they do not believe in God? Why they do not take to God consciousness or Kṛṣṇa consciousness? They are very educated, advanced. They have got university degrees. But why they do not do it? They are supposed to be very culturally advanced." So the answer is given there in the Bhagavad-gītā, māyayāpahṛta-jñānā āsuraṁ bhāvam āśritāḥ (BG 7.15). Because their intention is to deny God, therefore although they are very much advanced in so-called education, the effect of knowledge has been taken away by the illusory energy of māyā. The māyā has taken away the effect of knowledge.
Just like we met some Indian gentleman while coming. I asked him, "Why don't you come to temple?" "Swāmījī, I am searching after some employment. I have lost my employment." Just see. He has come from India—so, about fifteen thousand miles away—and the problem is still unemployment. Why he has come here, so far distant? That means he's educated. Otherwise, this country would not allow him immigration. But the problem is there, unemployment.
So there is very nice program, er, proverb in Bengali: yadi yao bhaṅge kaphala yabe saṅge.(?) That means, "Wherever you go, your this fortune..." Generally, when we speak of fortune we touch our head. Sometimes we say, "Oh, it is my misfortune." That means fortune may be written here. It is said. So, "Wherever you go, your this fortune will go with you." So how you can avoid your...?" If you have got nonsense fortune, then it will go with you. Either you go to Canada or you go to hell or you go to heaven, the fortune will go with you.
The Bhāgavata says, therefore, tasyaiva hetoḥ prayateta kovido na labhyate yad bhramatām upary adhaḥ (SB 1.5.18). You cannot change your fortune. That means, fortune means, you are, with this body, you have got certain amount of enjoyment and certain amount of distress. That is made already according to your past activities. That you can change. Just like due to some mistake, I may have some disease or infection, but there is medicine also to counteract that infection. That is possible. It is not that because I am misfortunate, it cannot be changed. It can be changed.
Similarly, what should be my attempt? The attempt should be, according to Bhāgavata, to understand the laws of nature, or the laws of God, and how it is working under His direction. That should be the attempt. You are making research. That's very nice. But your research is not complete, because you take something halfway: "This is the beginning of life" or "This is the beginning of the creation." No. You have to go still further, still go further. And science means you have to prove by experiment that "This law is working like this, and therefore things are happening like this." If you simply presuppose that "Here is the beginning," that is not perfect.
So duṣkṛtina means that those who do not believe in the authority. So many things are there which is beyond our conception, beyond our understanding. Our senses, our, I mean to say, instrument of acquiring knowledge, are so imperfect that it is not possible simply by handling our the present senses to understand the right knowledge. It is not possible.
So Śrīmad-Bhāgavata says, tasyaiva hetoḥ prayateta kovido na labhyate yad bhramatām upary adhaḥ (SB 1.5.18). Factually, an intelligent person is he who is trying to achieve that highest perfectional stage of life which cannot be achieved simply by touring different planets. Upary adhaḥ. Now we are trying to go to the moon planet and other planet. This is not new thing. It is very old attempt. Since there are human beings we have got so many instances. But in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said that ābrahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ punar āvartino 'rjuna (BG 8.16): even if you can go to the highest planet, which is called Brahmaloka, still, the problems of life cannot be solved.
The four problems of life—birth, death, old age and disease—cannot be solved. Therefore our attempt should be that we do not care for these problems. We have taken it, accepted that "All right, we shall take birth. We shall die. We shall become old. We shall become diseased. Doesn't matter. Still we are progressing." Just see. What is the progress? If you cannot solve these problem, then what kind of progress you are making? But they are satisfied, "Yes, we are making progress."
So this is called māyayāpahṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.15). They are not making any progress, even an inch, and still, they are proud of their progressive knowledge. This is called māyā. Māyā means what is not. Māyā. Mā means not. Not. Yā means this. This is māyā. He is thinking... The modern human society, they are thinking that advancing. But māyā: it is not. You are not advancing. What advancement you have made? Your problem is, the primary problem is, eating, sleeping, mating and defending. Oh, that is not solved. Your problem is birth, death, old age and disease. That is not solved. Then what, nuisance, you are doing in the name of progress? There is no progress. The real progress is to understand the laws of nature and how it is being conducted under the direction of the Supreme Lord. That is real progress.
So Bhāgavata indicates, tasyaiva hetoḥ prayateta kovidaḥ. Kovida means one who is actually intelligent. Not the mūḍhāḥ, rascals; actually one who is intelligent. He should try to solve the problems which is not possible to be done even if you travel over all the spaces up to the highest planet. Upary adhaḥ. Upary adhaḥ means upside all planets and downside all planets. There are millions of planets. If you travel...
But these problems... Just like your fortune will go with you in your head. You may go to moon planet, but this head will go with you. Yadi yao bhaṅge kaphala yabe saṅge.(?) You cannot change. If you have to attempt anything for real progress, then this is real progress. What is that? To know the Supreme Absolute Truth, which is manipulating all activities. That is real progress.
Bhāgavata again says, na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31): "These rascals, they do not know where is the ultimate destination of his self-interest." Everyone is very much busy or very serious about his self-interest. Everyone. Just like the gentleman. He could not come to the temple because he is interested with his self-interest, where to get the employment. But what is that real self-interest they do not know. This is temporary self-interest. But the real self-interest is Viṣṇu, the Supreme Lord, Absolute Truth. Na te viduḥ. But modern education and any education, modern or past, in the material world, those who are conditioned by the material laws, they do not know. So what is his ultimate destination of self-interest? Na te viduḥ. They do not know.
Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum. Viṣṇu means the Supreme Lord, all-pervading. Why? Durāśayā. Durāśayā means ill-conceived plan. They are thinking that they will be happy by planning in this material world. This is called durāśā. It will never be fulfilled. It will never be fulfilled. Durāśā. Dura means it is impossible. But they will not accept it. They will not accept it. They are being knocked so many times—failure, failure, failure, failure. Still, they will not accept. Durāśayā. Bahir-artha-māninaḥ: "They are captivated by the glamour of this external energy." Bahir-artha-māninaḥ.
Adānta-gobhiḥ: "And the main disease is uncontrolled senses." Adānta. Adānta means uncontrolled, unbridled senses. Because the senses, being unbridled, they will not allow you to understand in cool head what is the problem. Adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisram. Just like if you are sitting on a car where the horses are unbridled, and it is running on in great speed without your control, you do not know where..., when you will be in danger. You will be in danger. You are already in danger, because the horses are unbridled. It is pulling you anywhere it likes. Similarly, our horses—the senses are called horses—it is being uncontrolled. Viśatāṁ tamisram. It is going to the darkest region of hellish condition.
Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). And such persons are repeatedly chewing the chewed. One plan is made; that is frustrated. Another plan again made, again frustrated. Again plan made, again frustrated. But still, they will go on plan-making, but they will never accept the actual truth. Therefore Bhagavad-gītā says, māyayāpahṛta-jñānāḥ (BG 7.15): "Their knowledge has been taken away by the energy of māyā." Māyā apahṛta-jñānāḥ.
Why māyā is taking away? Āsuri bhāvam āśritāḥ. Because they have taken this principle, to deny God. That's it. Only for this reason, for this fault only, the māyā is acting so severely. Māyā will never allow such person to understand the real thing. They will go on making plan-making; it will be frustrated. Again plan-making, again frustrated, again frustrated.
So this process is going on because they do not know that their self-interest is that Supreme Personality of Godhead. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says that He comes, He descends, with two purposes: paritrāṇāya sādhūnām (BG 4.8), to give relief to the pious, to the righteous; and to vanquish the miscreants, and to establish the real religious principle.
And what is that real religious principle? That is stated in the last instruction: sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). This is real religion, to surrender unto the Supreme Personality of Godhead. That's all. This is done even by great philosophers. He has to do that. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante (BG 7.19). But he's now mentally speculating to find out the Absolute Truth, but when his knowledge will be mature, bahūnāṁ janmanām, after many, many births of speculation, bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate, when he is actually in knowledge, he surrenders unto the Supreme Lord, vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti (BG 7.19): "Oh, Lord Kṛṣṇa, Vāsudeva, Vāsudeva is everything." Sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ: "Such kind of great soul is very rare."
But fortunately, we have got these instruction of Bhagavad-gītā, and the teacher is Lord Caitanya. If we follow these principles and try to understand it with all our knowledge, all our logic and argument, then our life is successful. Here is an opportunity: the movement of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And it is very easy. You simply sit down. If you don't like to come to this temple, it doesn't matter.
At..., in your home only, you sit down with your friends, with your boyfriend or girlfriend or family members, children. Sit down and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. If you have got a nice musical instrument, it is all right. Otherwise, God has given you these hands. You can clap, (claps) "Hare Kṛṣṇa." Very easy. Just try it, and you will understand everything gradually. Ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12, Śikṣāṣṭaka 1). By simply chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, gradually all coverings, all dust accumulated on the mirror of your...
(break) ...and what are the activities. These five things are there: God, the living entity, the material nature, the time and the activities. If you can thoroughly study these five principles, then you become perfectly advanced in knowledge, and your life is successful. And all this will be possible simply by this chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. And when your mind will be cleansed, you will be able to understand the instruction of Bhagavad-gītā automatically. These things are there.
Thank you very much. Any question?
Guest: Swāmī, for my benefit, and perhaps everyone else's, (indistinct), can you tell us briefly what you mean by Kṛṣṇa consciousness?
Prabhupāda: I have several times explained this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Again I shall explain. It is very nice question. You have got your consciousness. Is it right? Every one of us, we have got consciousness. Is that right? Now, this consciousness is eternal. This consciousness is not a result of the combination of matter. You cannot create consciousness by mixing so many chemicals or material things in the laboratory. That is not possible. This consciousness, eternal.
How do we know it? Because we understand it from Bhagavad-gītā. It is stated that avināśi tu tad viddhi yena sarvam idaṁ tatam (BG 2.17): "That thing which is spread all over your body." And what is that thing? This consciousness. You pinch any part of your body, you feel pain, because the consciousness is there. "So that thing, consciousness," Kṛṣṇa says, the teacher of Bhagavad-gītā, "that is eternal." Eternal. Now, how it is eternal? When you were a child, the consciousness was there. Then you grew up to your boyhood—the consciousness was there. Then you are now young—the consciousness is there. And when you become old man like me, the consciousness will be there.
Therefore, in spite of my changing different kinds of body, the consciousness is there. And when I shall change this body for another new body, this consciousness will go with me. And according to that consciousness, I'll get a particular type of body.
So at the present moment, because we are changing different kinds of body, that means my consciousness is not pure. And we have to make our consciousness pure, which is technically called Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And as soon as the consciousness is pure, you get your eternal, existentional life. That is the sum and substance of becoming Kṛṣṇa conscious. And this movement is for that purpose, Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
You have any other inquiry about... (break)
Guest (1): Yes, Swāmī. You mentioned new bodies. Does this embrace reincarnation? That is, when we leave the physical body we have now on death, do you mean that the consciousness goes on?
Prabhupāda: Yes. This incarnation is going on every minute, because you are changing your body. Imperceptibly you are changing your body. That is a medical, scientific point, that we are changing our body every second, every minute. This change—you call change, or you can transfer your identity from one body to another, it means the same thing. You see?
So similarly, the ultimate change of this body is called death. When this body is no more workable, then we transmigrate to another body. That body is offered to us according to our consciousness. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā: yaṁ yaṁ vāpi smaran loke tyajaty ante kalevaram (BG 8.6). At the time of death, the situation of your consciousness makes you ready for accepting a similar body. And if you quit this body in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then you get a body by which you can associate with Kṛṣṇa. That is to be understood, how it is possible. Therefore the training should be Kṛṣṇa conscious.
(break) ...in particular type of consciousness. That we cannot deny. Now if we change our consciousness to Kṛṣṇa type of consciousness, or Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that is perfection of our life. The process is: by chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa we keep always alive to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. (break)
Guest (1): ...how long it will take for anyone can achieve perfection? How many stages one must go through, or how many years, how many centuries?
Prabhupāda: No. There is no such stereotype rules that you have to do it for so many years, so many... It depends on your personal energy of progress. It is very simple to understand. Suppose a man is diseased. No doctor can guarantee that "This will be cured in so many days." You see? It depends on the situation of the patient's condition and accepting the treatment. Similarly, it can be cured in one day or it may not be cured in one thousand days. That will depend on the patient.
(break) ...have got instances that one got perfection in Kṛṣṇa consciousness within a few second also. That is also possible. Because it is spiritual, it does not depend on any material rules and regulation. It depends on my seriousness. Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā you have got instruction by Lord Kṛṣṇa,
- sarva-dharmān parityajya
- mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja
- ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo
- mokṣayiṣyāmi mā śucaḥ
- (BG 18.66)
"My dear Arjuna, you just surrender unto Me, and I take charge of you and make you free from all reaction of your past activities." So if we seriously surrender to God, or Kṛṣṇa, then immediately our desire is fulfilled. Immediately.
But we are not prepared. That is the difficulty. Māyā will instruct me, "Why? Why you shall surrender?" That's it. So it depends on me how long it will take to cure this disease. Therefore in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam it is said, sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje (SB 1.2.6): "That type of religion is perfect by which one can surrender or can incline, can be inclined, or develop love of God." That's all.
It does not mention which religion you shall accept. You accept any religion. But test is, perfection of that religious procedure, whether you have developed ecstatic love for God. If you have achieved that, then that religious principle is first class. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmaḥ. Para means transcendental, first class; yato bhaktiḥ: "By executing which, you can have, I mean, develop, Kṛṣṇa consciousness or God consciousness." And that process is called ahaituki, "without any reason"; apratihatā, and it cannot be checked by any material condition.
If somebody thinks that "Well, I have been sinful for so many years, and even if I surrender to the God, it will take so many years," no, it is not like that. The surrendering process, if it is perfect, the result is immediately perfect. Ahaituky apratihatā yayātmā suprasīdati. And by such Kṛṣṇa consciousness, development of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, one's mind becomes fully satisfied. Yayātmā suprasīdati. Prasīdati means satisfaction, fully satisfied. Every one of us are trying to satisfy, to become satisfied. That is possible by attaining full Kṛṣṇa consciousness. (break)
Devotee (2): What happens to the miscreants when they are vanquished?
Devotee (1): (explaining) What happens to the miscreants when they are vanquished?
Prabhupāda: Don't you see how many miscreants are suffering? Even you go to the law court, you see how they are suffering. Somebody is putting into jail for so many years, somebody is being ordered to be hanged, somebody is being ordered to be whipped, and so many things are happening. And then you see so many animal life. There are 8,400,000's of different species of life. They are suffering.
The tree... If you get the body of a tree, you stand up for ten thousands of years in one place. We have got experience when teacher punishes us, "Stand up on the bench" for a few minutes, we become disturbed: "Sir, please excuse me. I shall not do this." Now, if you have to stand up for ten thousands of years in one place, just see. These are the punishment to the miscreants.
So this human body is the only opportunity to understand all these things and make your life successful so that you may not come again for standing up for seven thousand years or ten thousand years. You see? But the miscreants will not believe this. They think, "A tree, it is another thing. I am perfect." He does not know that every chance there is that you also become a tree.
These are practical examples. You can study. By nature's study you can understand how the miscreants are punished. But unfortunately we have become so dull that even by seeing or by hearing we do not believe them. That's it. Just like a thief. He sees personally that a man who has committed theft is taken away by the police to the custody, to the prison. He is seeing that, and he has heard the law that "Any man who steals, he will be punished." He has heard it, and he has seen it. Still, he commits, I mean to say, theft. Why? He is seeing, and he is hearing. In both ways he is understanding, but still, he is committing theft. That means his heart is not pure.
So the first thing is to make one's heart purified. And this is the process, ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam, paraṁ vijayate śrī-kṛṣṇa-saṅkīrtanam (CC Antya 20.12): by simply chanting, without paying any price, without any loss on your part. Please try to chant this Hare Kṛṣṇa and see the result. It is so nice movement.
(break) ...take it very seriously that "Here is an animal. Here is a tree. They have also got life. They are also living entities as we are. Simply it is different body. That's all." He has got that sort of body; I have got this sort of body. But the demands of the body are there. Even in cats and dogs the eating, sleeping, mating and defending... There is four symptoms of life.
The cat also, or dog also, eat; we also eat. They also sleep; we also sleep. They have their sex desires; we have got our sex desire. We want to defend from enemies; they also want to defend from enemies. Similarly, in every species of life we will find these four principles existing. How you can say that you are better than him?
You are better than him when you understand how the laws of material nature is working so that one has become tree to stand up for ten thousands of years, and I have got all freedom to move and to make education, to go to the school, colleges, take education, advancement of knowledge. That is the difference between tree and me.
So far necessities of the body, material body, is concerned, the demand is there; demand is here. You can accept from that type of body, by this body, simply by understanding, by advancing in knowledge. And the perfection of knowledge is to know who is God or where is God. That is perfection of knowledge.
So long one does not understand what is God or the Absolute Truth by whom everything is being emanated, the knowledge is imperfect. Knowledge is not finished. Therefore Bhagavad-gītā says, bahūnāṁ janmanām ante (BG 7.19): "After many, many births of cultivating knowledge, one comes to the understanding of accepting God is the prime source, fountainhead of everything." That is perfection of knowledge.
At the present moment people are denying the existence of God, or they are thinking that God is dead. That means imperfection of knowledge. They have to still make progress to the perfectional point. And that test is to understand, "Here is God, and He is the fountainhead of everything." That perfection of knowledge you will have simply by reading... Any scripture you can read, the same conception is there. But in the Bhagavad-gītā it is more clearly explained so that you can understand with all reason, arguments, and scrutiny too. It is not dogmatic. That is the beauty of Bhagavad-gītā.
Just like in some dictionary the word is explained in one word; in some dictionary it is explained that "The history of this word is like this," "This word can be explained like this, like that, like that," some pages like that. Similarly, so far dictionary, the small pocket dictionary is also dictionary, and that Webster's International big dictionary, that is also dictionary.
The difference is that international dictionary, you get details of one word. Similarly, any scripture is perfectly giving direction towards understanding what is God. But actually how God is great, how He is working, how His laws are working, all these things you can find in the Bhagavad-gītā and Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.
(kīrtana) (prema-dhvani) Thank you very much. (devotees offer obeisances) Hare Kṛṣṇa. (end)