770301 - Conversation A - Mayapur

Conversations by Date, 1977

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

770301R1-MAYAPUR - March 01, 1977 - 39:56 Minutes

(GBC Resolutions)

Satsvarūpa: First thing we did this morning was this resolution: Pañcadraviḍa Swami and Harikeśa Swami, who were serving during the year as acting GBCs, were accepted as full GBC members. And Bali-mardana, it was decided, should continue for the next year to act in the status of an acting GBC. Then Svarūpa Dāmodara was appointed as a GBC member on your request. Then we had an election of GBC officers. Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja was elected the chairman, Jayatīrtha was elected vice chairman, and Sats . . .

Prabhupāda: How many GBCs are there? List of men?

Satsvarūpa: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: There's twenty-one with the addition of Svarūpa Dāmodara.

Satsvarūpa: I have twenty.

Gargamuni: Yeah, twenty. I counted twenty too.

Satsvarūpa: Tamāla Kṛṣṇa, Kīrtanānanda, Satsvarūpa, Rūpānuga, Jayatīrtha, Balavanta, Gopāla Kṛṣṇa, Bhagavān, Jagadīśa, Svarūpa Dāmodara, Rāmeśvara, Bali-mardana, Pañcadraviḍa, Harikeśa, Haṁsadūta, Ātreya Ṛṣi, Gargamuni, Brahmānanda, Hṛdayānanda, Gurukṛpā.

Rāmeśvara: Did you read your name?

Satsvarūpa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Twenty, yes.

Satsvarūpa: So this is the election of the officers: Kīrtanānanda Swami, chairman; Jayatīrtha, vice chairman; Satsvarūpa, secretary.

Prabhupāda: Kīrtanānanda, president, er, chairman. Eh?

Satsvarūpa: Chairman. Jayatīrtha, vice chairman. Satsvarūpa, secretary. And then, in that regard, we passed a resolution that the position of chairman can only be held one year consecutively, every year changed, whereas vice president, secretary, may be held three years consecutively.

Prabhupāda: Why? That should be also one year.

Satsvarūpa: Also one year.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We felt that this would give everybody an opportunity to experience that position.

Prabhupāda: Hmm. That is the way. Amongst the same persons, one may get chance by selection, by majority vote. That is the way.

Hari-śauri: Democratic.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The persons are the same, twenty men. Now, by this selection of the majority persons, one becomes chairman for one year. Then everyone has the chance. That is the way. So that is . . . So secretaries and vice chairman also should be for one year.

Satsvarūpa: Then, in regard to these meeting, we passed this resolution, that . . . (break) . . . that we pass will be brought before Your Divine Grace for approval. Then they can be posted on a bulletin board so devotees can see what they were. Then after all the days' meetings of the GBC are finished, then we'll have a meeting of the temple presidents. If, at their meeting, by a two-thirds majority vote they suggest any amendments to the resolutions or make new resolutions, these will be sent back to the GBC, who will meet again and who will again vote . . .

Prabhupāda: "Send back" means not now? Not now?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. During these days.

Satsvarūpa: Yes.

Haṁsadūta: Immediately.

Prabhupāda: "Send back" means where?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, that means that today, tomorrow and the next day, the GBC will meet. Then the following morning, the morning of the fourth, the presidents will meet and they will give any changes to the GBC, and on the afternoon of the fourth the GBC will consider all changes.

Prabhupāda: Decide. Decide.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And that will be the end of the meeting.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Then, if the GBC does not decide by the decision of the presidents' meeting, then I shall decide?

Satsvarūpa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: All right. Then?

Satsvarūpa: We also resolved what Tamāla Kṛṣṇa just said, our schedule. So that we don't meet overlong, we resolved that we should finish our meetings by the third of March. President's meeting on the morning of the fourth. The GBC final meeting on the afternoon of the fourth. Then other meetings scheduled were that in the evening of the fourth there should be a meeting of all the sannyāsīs, including, of course, the GBC sannyāsīs.

Prabhupāda: No, no, what is the resolution of the sannyāsī meeting?

Satsvarūpa: Well, the purpose would be that everyone actually take out an assignment that he will take for the year, not that independently a sannyāsī . . .

Prabhupāda: No, sannyāsīs . . . GBC as a body, they should give direction to the sannyāsīs.

Satsvarūpa: At a sannyāsī meeting?

Prabhupāda: What is the use of meeting? There are so many sannyāsīs in the GBC. So that is sufficient. Mostly they are sannyāsīs. So whatever they have decided, that should be carried by other sannyāsīs. What is the wrong?

Satsvarūpa: No, not these resolutions.

Prabhupāda: Then why the sannyāsīs meeting again?

Satsvarūpa: For the particular service of each sannyāsī, so he will say, "I want to preach in Africa" or "I want to go to the colleges." Each man write down a commitment . . .

Prabhupāda: That is another thing. That is his preference how he wants to work. That's nice.

Satsvarūpa: That's the purpose of that meeting. And then we also scheduled the holding of the bhakti-śāstra exam for being on Gaura Pūrṇimā, the fifth.

Prabhupāda: Next.

Satsvarūpa: Yes, the next day.

Prabhupāda: That's good.

Satsvarūpa: Then our next business was the division of the zones.

Prabhupāda: Hmm. (aside) Where is our Bhagavān dāsa?

Hari-śauri: (aside) Shall I go and call him?

Satsvarūpa: Starting with South America . . . South America's responsibilities would be divided between Pañcadraviḍa Swami and Hṛdayānanda Mahārāja like this: Pañcadraviḍa would be responsible for the temples in Mexico and Central America, Guyana, Santo Domingo and Trinidad. And he will also work as required in the Los Angeles Spanish BBT office. And Hṛdayānanda Mahārāja will retain direct responsibility for Brazil, Venezuela, Colombia, Peru, Chile and Ecuador, and also he was going to take on co-GBC responsibilities in Spain and Portugal, which are the same language as the books he's printing in, along with Bhagavān, in whose zone that is, Spain and Portugal in Europe, for spreading Spanish book distribution. And as for the BBT duties that Hṛdayānanda Mahārāja has, he will have Pañcadraviḍa Mahārāja assist him in that also. We passed a resolution about . . .

Prabhupāda: What about the French printing and translation? That is stopped now?

Hṛdayānanda: No, it is not . . . it is not altogether stopped, but some members have left.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Some members have left, but . . .

Prabhupāda: Why?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hṛdayānanda Mahārāja was just there in France. He just paid a visit, so he'd be . . . what is your report, Hṛdayānanda, about the French BBT?

Hṛdayānanda: Well, some of the important members have left.

Prabhupāda: Why they have left?

Hṛdayānanda: Well, they were dissatisfied with Bhagavān.

Prabhupāda: That should be rectified. They are important members. They are translating.

Rāmeśvara: How will that be rectified?

Prabhupāda: What . . .? Why they should be dissatisfied? If the workers are dissatisfied, then who will work books?

Brahmānanda: Bhagavān claims that the BBT printing is still going on, that next month a Back to Godhead is coming out and also a Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

Prabhupāda: No, book . . .

Rāmeśvara: Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam within three months, in three months.

Prabhupāda: So if you are satisfied that things are going on, that is different thing, but so far . . . what is his name? Yogeś . . .?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yogeśvara.

Prabhupāda: Yogeśvara and his wife, they were doing very nice. Why they should leave?

Rāmeśvara: Bhagavān told me that Yogeśvara wanted to change his service because of family problems.

Gargamuni: He told me that also in Bhuvaneśvara, that the reason why he was leaving is because he wanted to work with his mother, who has some type of public relations job in the United States.

Brahmānanda: Bhagavān claims that all these men who signed this letter, they were spiritually weak.

Prabhupāda: So what you have decided? Yogeśvara was doing nice in translation, his wife was doing nice. So why should we lose these important hands?

Rāmeśvara: He hasn't been working at the French BBT for many months. He gave that up some time ago and was working with his wife at the gurukula.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He told me that he was frustrated. That's why he gave it up. When he was in New York he told me that had become discouraged.

Prabhupāda: So if Bhagavān and he does not agree, then he should be given better place that both husband and wife, they can go on with the translation work. It is not that he has to remain under the control of Bhagavān. That is not necessary. Let him translate independently, and wherever he likes, he can remain. What do you think?

Hṛdayānanda: He is not so much a translator.

Rāmeśvara: His wife was. (background discussion about who did what)

Prabhupāda: You see, nobody is translator. That we have to accept whatever is offered. Kānā māmā (blind uncle). Without māmā, it is better a blind māmā. That's all. That is our policy. So to remain without māmā is not very good choice. Must have a māmā, never mind he is blind. That is our policy. So now we are without māmā. Who is translating now?

Hṛdayānanda: The main translator, the most important translator is still working with Bhagavān, so translating is going on.

Prabhupāda: Going on.

Hṛdayānanda: Yes. The most important translator has not gone away.

Prabhupāda: Then it is . . . still, they should be encouraged. Why they should . . .? If they do not like, that is another thing. But our translation work, printing work, cannot be stopped. That is my request.

Hṛdayānanda: I don't think it will stop.

Prabhupāda: Then it is all right. You agree, all GBCs? All GBCs?

Rāmeśvara: We made a resolution that Jayatīrtha would go there initially, and then, after a few months, Ātreya Ṛṣi would go there to give him some advice for his financial problems. One of the reasons that the devotees are feeling pressure is because of lack of money, or bad money management.

Prabhupāda: No, that is a good, good idea.

Brahmānanda: Also, Bhagavān would go to America and spend one month to see how things are being managed there, because he has not been there for four years.

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Kīrtanānanda: I'd like to say, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that we discussed it for some time today, discussing this. And initially, at least, it was the feeling of the GBC that he should change zones.

Prabhupāda: So, he has agreed?

Kīrtanānanda: That he should go to the Midwest of the U.S. where we could have used him very much.

Prabhupāda: So this is . . .

Kīrtanānanda: But he . . . he was not very . . . he said he'd give up his zone, but he didn't want to go to the U.S. So then we felt that actually to take him out of his zone there . . . he was thinking to start something in Israel.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Kīrtanānanda: He said that he did not like . . . he'd like to start something new then. If he wasn't going to be in France, he wanted to start something new. So he said: "Well, let me go to Israel."

Rāmeśvara: Mid-East.

Prabhupāda: Middle East.

Kīrtanānanda: Well specially he said Israel. And if you work in Israel, you can't work anywhere else.

Hṛdayānanda: He wanted to work in the Mid-East.

Prabhupāda: And do you think that is all right?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, that's not as important as . . .

Kīrtanānanda: We felt he was too important a man to put there. So then we said, "Well, better that you stay in France if you're that determined . . ."

Rāmeśvara: ". . . to avoid America."

Kīrtanānanda: We really wanted him to come to the United States and help there.

Hṛdayānanda: But he was discouraged by that idea.

Kīrtanānanda: He said he could not get enthusiastic about that.

Prabhupāda: But to remain in France, if you think it is all right, that is another thing. But you said that he requires little change, you all GBC. What . . .?

Hṛdayānanda: Yes. That was the general feeling, that it would be good for both, for him and for France.

Kīrtanānanda: But we did not feel that he had done anything seriously wrong that would require our forcing a change on him.

Satsvarūpa: He doesn't feel he needs a change. He said: "Everyone has some trouble in their zone."

Prabhupāda: Then try to rectify. Then . . .

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. That was our final conclusion.

Kīrtanānanda: We did not want to force him.

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We wanted to encourage him, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That's nice. No, we have got flaw in every . . . so it is better to try to rectify it. That's all.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: A new concept which came up more and more in this GBC meeting was the concept of more than one GBC secretary helping on the same subject. That is, some responsibilities have been assigned to be shared.

Prabhupāda: Yes, very good.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: So with this idea, I am sure the situation can be rectified even to the point of bringing Yogeśvara and his wife back . . .

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: . . . if there is cooperation between Jayatīrtha Prabhu and Bhagavān Prabhu.

Prabhupāda: So that's a good idea. No, Jayatīrtha will be sent there.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So he'll be assistant secretary?

Satsvarūpa: No. What we resolved is that Bhagavān dāsa would stay in his present zone: France and Italy and Sweden and Amsterdam; but that as far as Jayatīrtha, he would visit Paris and New Māyāpur to assist with the financial problems there, and after some time . . .

Prabhupāda: Jayatīrtha and Ātreya Ṛṣi, both.

Satsvarūpa: Ātreya Ṛṣi would also go visit in June to try and help with the financial problems. And then . . .

Prabhupāda: What is the actual financial problem?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: What is the actual financial problem?

Bhagavān: There was just a little cash flow since last Māyāpur, because we spent a lot of money coming here. And this year a lot of saṅkīrtana devotees were ill.

Prabhupāda: Lot of money coming here from France? How is that?

Gargamuni: On transportation. Air flight.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: And also no one collected. He's improving that also.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: One problem is that to this date they have to separate the BBT account from the temple accounts. They are not yet separate, so that . . .

Bhagavān: It is separate.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I was informed that they weren't.

Devotee: No, theirs is separate now.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I don't know who to believe.

Prabhupāda: So anyway, printing and translation must continue. That is our main business. It cannot be stopped. Must go on. Just like persisting, now we have got so many Hindi literature. (laughs) I was simply persisting, "Where is Hindi? Where is Hindi?" So it has come to some tangible form. And I was simply poking him: "Where is Hindi? Where is Hindi?" So he has brought into fact. Similarly for French language also, very important, we must translate and bring books, as many as possible. "Bring books" means we have got already book. Simply translate it in the particular language and publish it. That's all. Idea is already there. You haven't got to manufacture idea. So France is very important country. So printing and translation must go on. That is my request. Then?

Satsvarūpa: Brahmānanda Mahārāja will retain GBC zonal responsibility of Africa and South Africa. However, he will get cooperation of Jayatīrtha, who will . . .

Prabhupāda: Occasionally.

Satsvarūpa: Yes. He is already GBC of South Africa, so they will become co-GBCs of both Africa and South Africa.

Prabhupāda: Very good arrangement.

Satsvarūpa: As for Jayatīrtha, he will keep England in his zone, but he is also going to take a zone in the United States, which he finds that he can travel to without much difficulty, which is the Midwest of the United States, including Detroit, Chicago, Minneapolis and a little center, Ann Arbor.

Prabhupāda: So you have all agreed to. That's nice.

Satsvarūpa: Harikeśa Mahārāja will mostly retain the same zone of Eastern European countries, Germany, Switzerland and Scandinavian countries.

Prabhupāda: So you have discussed Hare Kṛṣṇa, er, Harikeśa's activities, reviewed? It is all right?

Rāmeśvara: No. That is yet to be discussed under saṅkīrtana techniques.

Gargamuni: The techniques?

Prabhupāda: Not techniques. On the whole . . . he's the . . .

Kīrtanānanda: Jayatīrtha gave us a report.

Jayatīrtha: I gave very good reports. I had a very good experience as far as . . .

Prabhupāda: He is, after all, new appointed, so you have to study how things are going on.

Satsvarūpa: It was also decided regarding Harikeśa that because of the work he's done in Russia, nothing should be done in Russia without consulting with him.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Satsvarūpa: In Russia.

Prabhupāda: He's in charge of Russia. So "consulting" means? We shall not go? Who will do, and whom . . .?

Satsvarūpa: Well, say someone else, Gopāla Kṛṣṇa or someone, wanted to go to Russia to do some preaching, they would first approach Harikeśa Mahārāja and say what they wanted to do, work together with him.

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Satsvarūpa: Then the division of the United States.

Prabhupāda: Gopāla Kṛṣṇa went to Russia. He did some work. How GBC appreciate that work? Do they appreciate or not?

Jayatīrtha: It appears that he had several nice orders and reviews from the universities there.

Prabhupāda: So?

Rāmeśvara: It's considered a breakthrough. It's considered a great achievement . . .

Prabhupāda: Yes, then . . .

Rāmeśvara: . . . his work in Russia.

Prabhupāda: Then why, if he continues like that, what is the wrong there?

Harikeśa: I had a few objections, which I didn't bring up as a whole.

Prabhupāda: What is that objection?

Harikeśa: About the security for these people in the country itself. For example, the reviews that were gotten, somehow or another, the actual names of the professors were circulated, and this can cause them absolute havoc. And the books that were distributed in East Berlin never made it to the shelves. So that means they were censored, so that the people know that these books are not very good and they were suppressing it. So in Russia they know even quicker about this, that these books are not very good for them, and they censor them. So when they get censored, the people who accept them are in a little bit strange position. And then if we advertise that they wrote the review in the book, then they're in a very strange position.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I took all the books into East Berlin. When I went to East Berlin I took all the books through. Even though they were censored, I convinced them that "I'm a salesman of a book from . . ."

Harikeśa: But they never made it on the shelves.

Gargamuni: He's Indian, so they are not so . . . if he is an American, so there's nothing much he can do. But as an Indian, there's great friendship between Russian . . . they came to our stall in Calcutta and bought books. And they bought one poster of rāsa-līlā. So with India they are very friendly.

Harikeśa: It's simply meant that there's a certain amount of prerequisite knowledge one has to know before he goes into a Communist country . . .

Prabhupāda: No, another thing is that BBT you are keeping a separate organization. So if the BBT representative goes somewhere, so why he should be restricted?

Harikeśa: Well, for example he went to visit the two devotees we have in Moscow, and a KGB man followed him up to the door, and he tried to lose him. It was a whole thing. It seemed very risky for the people.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, the two devotee . . . we have one devotee, and with him I did so much preaching, so the KGB man, the Russian spy . . .

Prabhupāda: KGB? What is that?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: That's the Russian spy.

Gargamuni: Like CIA.

Gurukṛpā: The Russian cops.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: They were following me around, but still . . .

Prabhupāda: That they do for everyone.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I still got orders from everyone I saw.

Gargamuni: When Your Divine Grace went there, Śyāmasundara told me, they were also following.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Gargamuni: So that is common. They do that with everybody.

Prabhupāda: Regular practice.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: The Russian government sent me a New Year's card this year. I showed you that card? The Russian government sent us a New Year's card.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. I showed you in Bombay.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So I . . . what do you think, all GBC? He should be restricted in that way?

Rāmeśvara: There's no harm in being cautious.

Prabhupāda: Cautious we must be in every action. That is another thing. But for canvassing business, why one should be restricted?

Harikeśa: There's no question of restriction.

Haṁsadūta: No, it's just a matter of being cautious. That was his whole point.

Hṛdayānanda: It could be stated in such a way that Harikeśa will simply help. It's not a question of restricting the BBT salesman, but just to help him.

Prabhupāda: That is all right.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: We have sent them also books.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Ekala eka. One man's conclusion is not good. Better consult with him. Then?

Satsvarūpa: Then for the division of the United States, for myself, for being editor of Back to Godhead, I would go to Los Angeles for that, for Back to Godhead, but would also supervise the Northwest U.S. zone, which includes Berkeley, California; Seattle, Portland, Vancouver and the Dallas temple. Rāmeśvara Mahārāja would continue being the GBC for Los Angeles, San Diego, Laguna Beach and Denver. Balavanta Prabhu would keep his same zone—Atlanta; the Tennessee farm; Gainesville and Miami, Florida; New Orleans and the Mississippi farm; and Houston, Texas. Rūpānuga would also keep his same zone—Washington, D.C.; Baltimore; Philadelphia; St. Louis; the St. Louis farm; Ottawa; and Montreal, Canada. Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja would keep his same zone—New Vrindaban, Buffalo, Toronto, Pittsburgh and Cleveland. Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja was accepted as your permanent secretary, and therefore, for the vacancy created in his absence in New York, Pennsylvania farm, Boston, Puerto Rico . . .

Rāmeśvara: And Rādhā-Dāmodara.

Satsvarūpa: . . . and the Rādhā-Dāmodara party, it was decided that he should keep the responsibility of being the GBC for that area. However, Ādi-keśava Mahārāja will act as special assistant to the GBC and take the on-the-spot responsibility.

Prabhupāda: That means he'll be trained up in his place. Is it not?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: That's nice.

Satsvarūpa: And also Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja will retain responsibility for Red China, whatever can be done there.

Prabhupāda: That's very good. (laughter) I asked him to do this last year. Very good.

Satsvarūpa: India was broadly divided the same as it is now, of Gopāla Kṛṣṇa to do the north and west, Gargamuni Mahārāja to do the east—Calcutta, Māyāpur. And in that connection we resolved that Śatadhanya Mahārāja should take responsibility for being president of Calcutta and Panihati.

Prabhupāda: Why two?

Gargamuni: Panihati is very near to . . .

Prabhupāda: No, no, Panihati he can take, but why Calcutta?

Gargamuni: Because for maintenance sake, Panihati and Calcutta is the same place for collecting funds.

Prabhupāda: Why?

Gargamuni: It's a factory area . . .

Prabhupāda: No, no, and our Abhirāma is doing in Calcutta.

Gargamuni: Well, actually he doesn't stay in Calcutta, and the . . .

Rāmeśvara: We were informed that he does not want to remain as president.

Prabhupāda: So that will be decided in the presidents' meeting?

Rāmeśvara: Better make a note, Satsvarūpa.

Hṛdayānanda: It was stated that most of the time he is not in Calcutta, and that the main purpose of Calcutta is to make Life Members, but this year he has not made a single Life Member.

Gargamuni: He's generally engaged in export of the cloth of Māyāpur and business work, which actually he's more suitable for, whereas Śatadhanya . . .

Prabhupāda: So you have all agreed?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. If you have agreed, I have no objection.

Rāmeśvara: We didn't discuss it with him, though, to see what his personal feeling . . .

Prabhupāda: So do. So do that. Do that.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Before posting it, it should be discussed.

Prabhupāda: Do that.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: His feelings should not be . . .

Prabhupāda: No. Everyone should remain in jubilation. That is wanted.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jubilation.

Prabhupāda: You cannot make depressed. No, that is not good.

Gargamuni: But he admits that he likes to do business work and export.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. You discuss.

Satsvarūpa: Then Haṁsadūta Mahārāja will retain responsibility for the south, Hyderabad.

Rāmeśvara: Including Hyderabad.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: All of South India.

Prabhupāda: Hyderabad is in the south. And further south, Ceylon? That's nice. Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrī Laṅkā. Today we're going to see the Hanumān, Song of Hanumān.

Kīrtanānanda: You have a note there about Prabhupāda's letter, that we're to be guided by that.

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Gargamuni: There's also a special mention that the Hyderabad farm should be run according to your direction of cooperation between Mahāṁśa Swami and Haṁsadūta Mahārāja

Prabhupāda: Yes. We have to develop this, an ideal farming. If you . . .

Haṁsadūta: I'm just a little hesitant, because I thought Mahāṁśa will be a little upset maybe.

Prabhupāda: Why?

Haṁsadūta: I don't . . .

Rāmeśvara: He wants to be a little independent. He wants to be in charge by himself.

Hṛdayānanda: But it was mentioned that he is not very competent.

Brahmānanda: Haṁsadūta Mahārāja planned that there's much debt in the Hyderabad temple. They owe one lakh of rupees.

Rāmeśvara: They owe Prabhupāda five lakhs.

Brahmānanda: Several lakhs.

Rāmeśvara: They owe Prabhupāda five lakhs.

Brahmānanda: Well, just on rations they owe one lakh.

Pañcadraviḍa: One lakh on rice.

Haṁsadūta: The whole situation is very deteriorated.

Prabhupāda: So why he does not come?

Haṁsadūta: Both with money and men. His best men all want to leave. His staunchest support, they have all become just completely discouraged. They want to go away.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Haṁsadūta: They all want to go, his men. And the temple is very badly in debt, and it has not had a proper president for just a very long time.

Prabhupāda: This cannot be.

Hṛdayānanda: It was suggested that he could preach in the area for support.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Or collect.

Rāmeśvara: Anyway, for this reason . . .

Prabhupāda: No, why don't you call him to study the whole situation?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, the real point is that the GBC should meet with him . . .

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: . . . and Haṁsadūta together and work out the problems.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So he is expected here, and when he comes, we'll meet with him.

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Satsvarūpa: Then Gurukṛpā Mahārāja retained responsibility in Hawaii and Japan and Hong Kong; Bali-mardana, responsibility for Australia, New Zealand, Fiji, the South Sea islands, and for book distribution in Southeast Asia.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He was the first to go there.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He invented Australia.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He invented Australia. (laughter)

Bali-mardana: It was only when your lotus feet touched Australia that it became worthwhile.

Prabhupāda: I was insisting, South Pacific organization.

Pañcadraviḍa: Just see even when I went through Bangkok, they had met with, erm, they knew of Bali-mardana and also Amogha and some of the other devotees.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And our Sudāmā.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He has a very expansive area, Bali-mardana, just like his namesake.

Prabhupāda: Bali. Bali means very powerful.

Satsvarūpa: Then Ātreya Ṛṣi will retain the Mid-East zone. And that's all we did today.

Prabhupāda: That's nice. Very good. All right.

Devotees: Jaya. All glories to Śrīla Prabhupāda. (obeisances) (break)

Prabhupāda: So you have to understand it. How you can, mean, simplify it?

Rāmeśvara: But just like sometimes for Back to Godhead . . .

Prabhupāda: No, no. First of all come to the practical point. How he'll make it more easily understandable? Dharma-kṣetra is a place. Māyāpur is a place. There is . . .

Rāmeśvara: That cannot be changed.

Prabhupāda: So everything is like that. Why do you endeavor to make it easier?

Rāmeśvara: I think their point is like this, that sometimes in Back to Godhead . . .

Prabhupāda: Give me some example that, "This is difficult, and if you put it in this way it will be easier."

Rāmeśvara: It's for telling a story, whereas in the Bhāgavatam . . .

Jagadīśa: We're talking about children's books.

Rāmeśvara: Children's books.

Jagadīśa: For the gurukula.

Rāmeśvara: Yes. (to Jagadīśa) Can you explain that?

Jagadīśa: For example, Śrīla Prabhupāda, we take Bhagavad-gītā . . .

Gurukṛpā: Eight hundred dollars.

Prabhupāda: Oh. This is American?

Bhagavān: It's French money.

Hari-śauri: Francs.

Jagadīśa: If we take the first purport in the Bhagavad-gītā . . .

Prabhupāda: Purport is not for the children. They should simply understand the word meaning. That's all. Purport is not for the children.

Jagadīśa: They need something to read.

Rāmeśvara: Stories.

Jagadīśa: Need to practice reading.

Prabhupāda: So that is not Bhagavad-gītā.

Jagadīśa: No. So then we have Kṛṣṇa book. Bhagavad-gītā is not used for the younger children. Bhagavad-gītā is used after they are nine or ten.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa book also difficult, but there is some philosophy sometimes.

Rāmeśvara: Actually all the time. You have given philosophy on every page.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bhagavān: This idea of Yogeśvara leaving . . . actually, Yogeśvara doesn't want to leave so much . . .

Rāmeśvara: Let us finish this point. This is very important for the whole BBT.

Bhagavān: Oh. I thought this was about the children's books.

Rāmeśvara: No, no. Yes, but it's a general point. It will tie in later.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, I'm just thinking that in about ten minutes you're going to have to go down. This could be discussed during the massage.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Rāmeśvara: So we can fix a time. Because of the meetings, there's no chance.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There'll be time.

Hari-śauri: We can fix a time.

Prabhupāda: During massaging.

Rāmeśvara: After the GBC meetings.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Śrīla Prabhupāda, this, the account that you have, I am keeping for you, the second, third month interest is due. Shall I give exactly like before? A check to him?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: To be deposited . . .

Prabhupāda: You deposit in the Māyāpur.

Rāmeśvara: In Los Angeles, that check.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: That's the check. And also the Tehran yātrā is making an additional two thousand dollar donation to Your Divine Grace. Shall I give him a check, or shall I put it in your account? Which way you like?

Prabhupāda: No, no. You can directly put in my account.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Put it in which account? In Māyāpur account? Or shall I put it in my account and give you interest?

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Whichever you like. I am giving . . .

Prabhupāda: He gives eighteen percent interest.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Eighteen percent interest.

Rāmeśvara: That's the best in the world.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) So you can do that.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: You want this two thousand added to your account.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And inform me just like this account . . .

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Yes, I will give you a letter. I give you a check for two thousand, and you will give it back to me and I'll give you a receipt.

Prabhupāda: No, you can simply give me advice.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Okay. I will give you a note, "Two thousand added." But the interest, you want regularly go every three months.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: I will give it to him.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Thank you.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Not only that you get eighteen percent interest, the money is used for Kṛṣṇa also.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (chuckles) (end)