770519 - Conversation - Vrndavana: Difference between revisions
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Sita Ram Singh: I came from Delhi. I got down here: "I want holy ''darśanas''." | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' I came from Delhi. I got down here: "I want holy ''darśanas''." | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' . . . (indistinct) | '''Prabhupāda:''' . . . (indistinct) | ||
Sita Ram Singh: He told me, "He's not keeping good health . . ." "Of course, I won't speak to him, but simply I will have his ''darśana''." Because you are superhuman being . . . (Prabhupāda chuckles) Everyone wants a blessing of persons like you. What you have done, and to remember these things . . . one feels himself satisfied only after having your ''darśana''. You do me this favor . . . | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' He told me, "He's not keeping good health . . ." "Of course, I won't speak to him, but simply I will have his ''darśana''." Because you are superhuman being . . . (Prabhupāda chuckles) Everyone wants a blessing of persons like you. What you have done, and to remember these things . . . one feels himself satisfied only after having your ''darśana''. You do me this favor . . . | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' You . . . you belong to Delhi? | '''Prabhupāda:''' You . . . you belong to Delhi? | ||
Sita Ram Singh: No, I belong to Bihar. I come from the constituency of the . . . (indistinct). On the way I got down here, and I was so fortunate I got ''darśana''. Mathura . . . (indistinct) . . . told me, "You can have your ''prasāda'' here." But "I shall take a part of ''prasāda''." But the ''prasāda'' what I want, I want ''darśana''. And if you have got any sympathy for me, kindly . . . | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' No, I belong to Bihar. I come from the constituency of the . . . (indistinct). On the way I got down here, and I was so fortunate I got ''darśana''. Mathura . . . (indistinct) . . . told me, "You can have your ''prasāda'' here." But "I shall take a part of ''prasāda''." But the ''prasāda'' what I want, I want ''darśana''. And if you have got any sympathy for me, kindly . . . | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' I have got sympathy for everyone. | '''Prabhupāda:''' I have got sympathy for everyone. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Ah, yes. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Ah, yes. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Unfortunately, nobody cares to hear. | '''Prabhupāda:''' Unfortunately, nobody cares to hear. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: That's right. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' That's right. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' They have their own program. ''Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥ'' ([[SB 7.5.31|SB 7.5.31]]). Blind men leading blind men. You realize that your Constitution is defective? | '''Prabhupāda:''' They have their own program. ''Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥ'' ([[SB 7.5.31|SB 7.5.31]]). Blind men leading blind men. You realize that your Constitution is defective? | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Yes, of course. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Yes, of course. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Then what is the use of changing? The same instrument . . . so our proposal is that unless the limbs are perfect, the end cannot be perfect. So we are presenting, therefore, the limbs of ''Bhagavad-gītā'', perfect, everything. But they are manufacturing their own way. There are so many parties—Ch.D. D.A.C. Ph.D . . . | '''Prabhupāda:''' Then what is the use of changing? The same instrument . . . so our proposal is that unless the limbs are perfect, the end cannot be perfect. So we are presenting, therefore, the limbs of ''Bhagavad-gītā'', perfect, everything. But they are manufacturing their own way. There are so many parties—Ch.D. D.A.C. Ph.D . . . | ||
Sita Ram Singh: (laughs) All they have got is party for their own selfish end. Actually it's taking north to south. Though I belong toward the party, but I must . . . (indistinct) . . . because they have all got their own selfish aims. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' (laughs) All they have got is party for their own selfish end. Actually it's taking north to south. Though I belong toward the party, but I must . . . (indistinct) . . . because they have all got their own selfish aims. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' They are interested to keep the new position of the party. Who is thinking of the public? Public is in the same distressed condition. | '''Prabhupāda:''' They are interested to keep the new position of the party. Who is thinking of the public? Public is in the same distressed condition. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Same distressed. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Same distressed. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Rather, they are more distressed. Take, for example, in our childhood my father's income was, utmost, three hundred rupees. So we were not very rich men, but we had no want. Father was maintaining his family, getting children married, distributing the wealth. Everything very nice. And we never felt any want. In this mango season, because father thought it that "There must be a full basket of mangoes daily for the children," so we were jumping, playing and eating mangoes. And now, taking consideration of gold standard . . . at that time my mother was purchasing gold, twenty rupees . . . | '''Prabhupāda:''' Rather, they are more distressed. Take, for example, in our childhood my father's income was, utmost, three hundred rupees. So we were not very rich men, but we had no want. Father was maintaining his family, getting children married, distributing the wealth. Everything very nice. And we never felt any want. In this mango season, because father thought it that "There must be a full basket of mangoes daily for the children," so we were jumping, playing and eating mangoes. And now, taking consideration of gold standard . . . at that time my mother was purchasing gold, twenty rupees . . . | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Per tolā. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Per tolā. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Twenty-two rupees. Now the same gold is six hundred rupees. So three hundred times more? | '''Prabhupāda:''' Twenty-two rupees. Now the same gold is six hundred rupees. So three hundred times more? | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Yes. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Yes. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' If my father's income was three hundred rupees, increased by three hundred, it becomes nine thousand. So where is the nine-thousand-rupees income for a middle-class man? | '''Prabhupāda:''' If my father's income was three hundred rupees, increased by three hundred, it becomes nine thousand. So where is the nine-thousand-rupees income for a middle-class man? | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Quite. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Quite. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Nine thousand rupees', ten thousand rupees' income is for very, very big man. But comparing, say, sixty, seventy years ago, we were a middle-class man. So a middle-class man has not increased his income from three hundred rupees to ten thousand rupees. That means everybody has become poor. So where is the advancement? Simply beating the drum, will this . . .? In our childhood we have seen mustard oil, first class, made in Kanpur. We were purchasing, eight annas per two and a half ser. | '''Prabhupāda:''' Nine thousand rupees', ten thousand rupees' income is for very, very big man. But comparing, say, sixty, seventy years ago, we were a middle-class man. So a middle-class man has not increased his income from three hundred rupees to ten thousand rupees. That means everybody has become poor. So where is the advancement? Simply beating the drum, will this . . .? In our childhood we have seen mustard oil, first class, made in Kanpur. We were purchasing, eight annas per two and a half ser. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: And now it has gone thirteen rupees. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' And now it has gone thirteen rupees. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Thirteen rupees. | '''Prabhupāda:''' Thirteen rupees. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Thirteen rupees in our time. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Thirteen rupees in our time. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Ghee, first-class ''ghee'', we were purchasing, one rupee, Vardwa ''ghee''. Now what is the price of ''ghee''? | '''Prabhupāda:''' Ghee, first-class ''ghee'', we were purchasing, one rupee, Vardwa ''ghee''. Now what is the price of ''ghee''? | ||
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'''Indian man (1):''' Twenty-five. | '''Indian man (1):''' Twenty-five. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Twenty rupees. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Twenty rupees. | ||
'''Indian man (1):''' Twenty, twenty-five. Between twenty and twenty-five, depending upon the place. | '''Indian man (1):''' Twenty, twenty-five. Between twenty and twenty-five, depending upon the place. | ||
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'''Indian man (1):''' No sense. Not at all. | '''Indian man (1):''' No sense. Not at all. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: No sense. No sense at all. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' No sense. No sense at all. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Simply nonsense. So what is remedy? ''Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās te 'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ'' ([[SB 7.5.31|SB 7.5.31]]). All over the world . . . of course, we do not want to criticize, but according to ''śāstra'', people will suffer more and more. And they must suffer, because they are becoming godless. They must suffer. That is nature's punishment. | '''Prabhupāda:''' Simply nonsense. So what is remedy? ''Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās te 'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ'' ([[SB 7.5.31|SB 7.5.31]]). All over the world . . . of course, we do not want to criticize, but according to ''śāstra'', people will suffer more and more. And they must suffer, because they are becoming godless. They must suffer. That is nature's punishment. | ||
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:([[BG 7.14 (1972)|BG 7.14]]) | :([[BG 7.14 (1972)|BG 7.14]]) | ||
They won't take the real culture given by God Himself, Kṛṣṇa, "Do like this." Therefore they are godless. They must suffer. Now the suffering is awaiting to the general mass of people. ''Durbhikṣa'' . . . ''anāvṛṣṭi-durbhikṣa-kara-pīḍitāḥ'' ([[SB 12.2.9|SB 12.2.9]]). There will be no rain from the sky, and therefore there will be no sufficient grains. ''Anāvṛṣṭi-durbhikṣa''. And in the name of improving the situation, government will tax. ''Kara-pīḍitāḥ''. In this way, so the people in general, they'll be so much harassed that without being able to manage things . . . '' | They won't take the real culture given by God Himself, Kṛṣṇa, "Do like this." Therefore they are godless. They must suffer. Now the suffering is awaiting to the general mass of people. ''Durbhikṣa'' . . . ''anāvṛṣṭi-durbhikṣa-kara-pīḍitāḥ'' ([[SB 12.2.9|SB 12.2.9]]). There will be no rain from the sky, and therefore there will be no sufficient grains. ''Anāvṛṣṭi-durbhikṣa''. And in the name of improving the situation, government will tax. ''Kara-pīḍitāḥ''. In this way, so the people in general, they'll be so much harassed that without being able to manage things . . . ''ācchinna-dāra-draviṇā gacchanti giri-kānanam''. "Let whatever I may have to the family eating. Let me go." This is the position. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: What will be the future of India? | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' What will be the future of India? | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' This will be future. Anywhere. Why you are speaking of India? What is spoken in the śāstra, that is not for India or for Bihar. It is for everywhere. | '''Prabhupāda:''' This will be future. Anywhere. Why you are speaking of India? What is spoken in the śāstra, that is not for India or for Bihar. It is for everywhere. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: And the situation is going from bad to worse. Will it go . . . | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' And the situation is going from bad to worse. Will it go . . . | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Yes. And at the end there will be no wheat, no rice, no sugar, no milk, and you'll have to eat . . . I shall eat your flesh; you shall eat my flesh. They are eating already fetus of their own sons. What is that? | '''Prabhupāda:''' Yes. And at the end there will be no wheat, no rice, no sugar, no milk, and you'll have to eat . . . I shall eat your flesh; you shall eat my flesh. They are eating already fetus of their own sons. What is that? | ||
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'''Tamāla Kṛṣṇa:''' Abortion. They have legalized abortion. So the unborn fetus, after it's aborted, they're eating as food. | '''Tamāla Kṛṣṇa:''' Abortion. They have legalized abortion. So the unborn fetus, after it's aborted, they're eating as food. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: They have devised also even in India also. I don't know about . . . | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' They have devised also even in India also. I don't know about . . . | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Therefore I said: "Why do you speak of this country?" This will happen everywhere. | '''Prabhupāda:''' Therefore I said: "Why do you speak of this country?" This will happen everywhere. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: <span style="color:# | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Is tarah agar pāpa hoga,</span> <span style="color:#128807">(If this kind of sin happens,)</span> then how one can expect betterment of the nation? | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Pāpa? <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' Pāpa? <span style="color:#ec710e">Paap to kuch suna hi nahi.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Haven't heard of sin.)</span> <span style="color:#ec710e">Itna paap hai.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(There is so much sin.)</span> ''Prakṛteḥ kriya'' . . . ([[BG 3.27 (1972)|BG 3.27]]) | ||
'''Indian man (1):''' Is there any way out? | '''Indian man (1):''' Is there any way out? | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Where the Kṛṣṇa consciousness . . . why don't you come? You'll not come. You'll stick to your own principle. Here is the way out: ''mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti'' ([[BG 7.14 (1972)|BG 7.14]]). "No." You'll make your own party, that's all, and suffer. What can be done? You'll never take good advice from Kṛṣṇa. You'll take advice from Indira Gandhi. That's it. (indistinct Hindi) And discontentment. <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' Where the Kṛṣṇa consciousness . . . why don't you come? You'll not come. You'll stick to your own principle. Here is the way out: ''mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti'' ([[BG 7.14 (1972)|BG 7.14]]). "No." You'll make your own party, that's all, and suffer. What can be done? You'll never take good advice from Kṛṣṇa. You'll take advice from Indira Gandhi. That's it. (indistinct Hindi) And discontentment. <span style="color:#ec710e">Ye sab kuch hai hi nahi . . . "andha yatandir" bolne se thoda apradhi ho jata hai. baat hi aisa andha andhe ko chalayeg.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(All this is not there . . . "''Andha yatandir''." Just by saying . . . this is a fact. A blind man leads another blind man.)</span> ''Durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ''. ''Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ'' ([[SB 7.5.31|SB 7.5.31]]). They are trying to adjust things by the external nature. <span style="color:#ec710e">Bahut si baatein hain wo samajhna hi nahi chahte hain.aur samjhane se wo bigad jate hain.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(There are many facts which they don't want to understand and if we try to explain to them they get angry.)</span> ''Mūrkhāyopadeṣo hi prakopāya na''. <span style="color:#ec710e">Unko rehna hi to hai.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(They need to stay in something.)</span> Come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness and be happy. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: <span style="color:# | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">. . . shuru se hi hai uski, raasta to . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(. . . from the beginning it is, the path . . .)</span> | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Are shuru se nahi abhi se hi karo na. Shuru jo ho gaya. mistake to . . . hi nahi ye kaun si baat hai. han mistake agar hua hai to usko mano aur sudhar karo. Nahi hamara mistake hi chalta hai. Chalo. Bhagvan to ye hi batate hai na ki koi baat nahi jo kuch ho gaya "sarva dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja aham tvam sarva papebhyo" paap to jaroor hua hai itna mistake kiya hai itna badmashi kiya hai,</span> | ||
<span style="color:#128807">(Oh no from the beginning, start it right now, now that it has started. Mistakes have happened . . . what logic is this? If a mistake has happened, then accept it and rectify it. No, my mistake is going on, okay. God says whatever has happened in the past, forget it: "''Sarva dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja aham tvam sarva papebhy''." So many mistakes you have done, so much mischief you have done.)</span> "I will explain." And "Who cares for you?" <span style="color:# | <span style="color:#128807">(Oh no from the beginning, start it right now, now that it has started. Mistakes have happened . . . what logic is this? If a mistake has happened, then accept it and rectify it. No, my mistake is going on, okay. God says whatever has happened in the past, forget it: "''Sarva dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja aham tvam sarva papebhy''." So many mistakes you have done, so much mischief you have done.)</span> "I will explain." And "Who cares for you?" <span style="color:#ec710e">Are chalega Kṛṣṇa bhagvan hain, hum bhagvan hain . . . (indistinct) . . . mudha "na mam dushkritino mudha prapadyante nara dhama" atyant naradhama, maha papi wo bhagvan ke bare me bata raha hai. bade-bade vidwan hain " maya aparhta jyana" sab moorkh hi hain. aur thoda jo ABCD seekha hai wo bhi maya cheen liya. Kyu aasuri bhava . . . (indistinct) . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(It is okay Kṛṣṇa is God, I am also God . . . (indistinct) . . . fools. "''Na mam duskritino mudha prapadyante naradhama''." Completely fallen, very sinful and he is talking about god. They are all great scholars, "''Maya apahrta jnana''." All are fools and whatever little education one has, ABCD, that also is taken away by illusion. Why this demoniac mentality? . . . (indistinct) . . .)</span> | ||
'''Indian man:''' <span style="color:# | '''Indian man:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Jo kans ka dasha hua wo hi dasha ho raha hai.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(The condition in which Kamsa was, in that same condition we are all in.)</span> | ||
'''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Hoga hi. are bhai nature's law apko chodega nahi, aap chahe kitne pehalwan hain </span>. <span style="color:#128807">(It will happen. Hey brother nature's law will not spare you no matter how strong a wrestler you are.)</span> ''Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ'' ([[BG 3.27 (1972)|BG 3.27]]) . . . (indistinct) . . . ''ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate''. He is a rascal who is thinking, "I am independent." Rascal number one. Everyone is thinking, "Ah! I am independent." What is their independence? Hmm? <span style="color:#ec710e">Yehi moorkhta hai. sunega nahi, accha baat bolne se (verse) morrrkh ko upadesh dene se vo . . . kya karen. (break) humlog to mission start kiya to aaiye bhagvan jo bolta hai wo suniye na. ... ye Chaitanya Mahaprabhu ka mission hai. Sab guru ban jao. Chaitanya Mahaprabhu ka ye aadesh hai "ab to Bihar ya bangala sab ek hi hai. Chaitanya Mahaprbhu ka mission hai, wo keh rahe hain "amar agnya guru hoiya taro yei desh" jo desh me, gaon me, family me.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(It will happen. Nature's law will not spare you how ever strong you are . . . (indistinct) . . . this is foolishness. He will not listen if you tell something good. (verse) If you preach to a foolish man he . . . what to do? We started the mission inviting everyone to come and listen to what god has to say . . . this is the mission of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Everyone must become a preacher. This is the order of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. "Now Bihar and Bengal are the same. This is the mission of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. He is saying: "''Amar abnya guru haiya taro yei desh''." In the country, in the village, in the family, in the community. )</span> We are preaching ''Bhagavad-gītā'' ''As It Is'' . . . compromise and interpretation . . . | ||
<span style="color:# | <span style="color:#ec710e">community mepaida hokar aaya hai uske saath pyar karo guru banke, ye Chaitanya Mahaprabhu kahe hain "hamar agnya guru haiya taro ye desh" sara duniya me ghoomna nahi padega,wohi to jiska jaisa capacity hai . . . to wo kah sakta hai ki hum guru kasie ban jaye hume to kuch maloom hi nahi hai.. koi parvah nahi. guru banana bahut saral hai. kasie "jaro dakho tare kaho Kṛṣṇa upadesh" Kṛṣṇa jo bol diya hai bus usko suna do. itna simple hai. Ye nahi ki sona, magic dikhao . . . thagao, ye guru nahi, ye hai chor. krishan jo bataya hai usko sunana hai, ye koi mushkil hai kya. wo to Gita me likha usko thoda sa bol dena hai, wo guru ho gaya. ye jo sab pardeshi sab aaye hain wo kya sona banaye hai, magic dikhaye hain, bol diya dekho ji "krsnas tu bhagvan swayam"... Kṛṣṇa kehta hain "man mana mad bhakto mad yaji mam namaskuru"... "mam hi parth vyapashritya . . ." koi baat nahi paapi yoni hai to kya hua . . . (indistinct) . . . Kṛṣṇa jo bol raha hai usko laat mar kar phek diya aur jo moorkh bol diya usko le lo. are purva janma nahi badmashi hai isi janm ka. purva janm kyo jaate hain. isi janm ka badmashi dekho na uska phal bhogo na. itna door jane ka kya zaroorat hai. Gita me shuru hua hai "dharma kshetre kurukshetre sam veta yuyutsavah" ye jo ladai karne ke liye do party ikkhate hue hain, ye ladia karne ke liye, non-violence, uska arth, kitna bada badmashi, boliye.</span> | ||
<span style="color:#128807">(He is born in the community so deal with him with love by becoming his spiritual master. This Caitanya Mahāprabhu is saying ''amar ajnya guru haiya taro ye desh''—you don't have to roam around in the world, depends on the capacity then he can say how can I become a master when I don't know anything. Does not matter. To become a master is very simple. How ''jare dekho tare kaho Kṛṣṇa upadesh''—whatever Kṛṣṇa has told just repeat it, so simple. Not that you show some magic, bring gold, or cheat people, this is not master, this is cheater. Whatever Kṛṣṇa has told just tell. Where is the difficulty in this? It is written in the ''Gītā'', you have to say that and you become a spiritual master. All these foreigners who have come they have not shown magic, not brought gold, they simply say ''krsnas tu bhagavan swayam''. Kṛṣṇa says: "''man mana bhava mad bhakto mad yaji mam namaskuru mam hi parth vyapashrityah''" does not matter if he is a sinner . . . (indistinct) . . . what Kṛṣṇa is saying you ignore that and accept what a fool is saying. This is not the result of previous karma but is the mischief of this life. Why do you go to the previous life, suffer the results of reactions of your ''karma'' in this life. Why do you go so far. In ''Gītā'' it starts with "''dharma kshetre kurukshetre sam veta yuyutsavah''"—the two armies are on the battlefield to fight, to battle, non-violence, what is the meaning of this, such foolishness is it not.)</span> | <span style="color:#128807">(He is born in the community so deal with him with love by becoming his spiritual master. This Caitanya Mahāprabhu is saying ''amar ajnya guru haiya taro ye desh''—you don't have to roam around in the world, depends on the capacity then he can say how can I become a master when I don't know anything. Does not matter. To become a master is very simple. How ''jare dekho tare kaho Kṛṣṇa upadesh''—whatever Kṛṣṇa has told just repeat it, so simple. Not that you show some magic, bring gold, or cheat people, this is not master, this is cheater. Whatever Kṛṣṇa has told just tell. Where is the difficulty in this? It is written in the ''Gītā'', you have to say that and you become a spiritual master. All these foreigners who have come they have not shown magic, not brought gold, they simply say ''krsnas tu bhagavan swayam''. Kṛṣṇa says: "''man mana bhava mad bhakto mad yaji mam namaskuru mam hi parth vyapashrityah''" does not matter if he is a sinner . . . (indistinct) . . . what Kṛṣṇa is saying you ignore that and accept what a fool is saying. This is not the result of previous karma but is the mischief of this life. Why do you go to the previous life, suffer the results of reactions of your ''karma'' in this life. Why do you go so far. In ''Gītā'' it starts with "''dharma kshetre kurukshetre sam veta yuyutsavah''"—the two armies are on the battlefield to fight, to battle, non-violence, what is the meaning of this, such foolishness is it not.)</span> | ||
'''Indian man:''' <span style="color:# | '''Indian man:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Tumhara Kṛṣṇa bhagvan dekh rahe hain. Arjun jab . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Your Kṛṣṇa is watching. When Arjun . . .)</span> | ||
'''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Are aap pehle dekhiye. ye jo words hai "dharma kshetre...." yuyutsava ka arth kya hota hai, boliye. ladia karna, aur ladai karne ke liye sab ikkhata hue hain aur non-violence. ye koi arth hai. (indistinct Hindi) doosre ko badnami karna hai aur khu bhi. usko sab sudhariye, tab apka leadership . . . nahi to "andha yatandir . . ."</span> <span style="color:#128807">(You see first these words "''Dharma kshetre'' . . ." ''yuyutsava'' what is the meaning of this, tell. To fight and to battle they have all gathered and to speak of non-violence. Is there any meaning in this . . . (indistinct) . . . to defame others and also to get a bad name for oneself. Rectify all this, then your leadership . . . otherwise "''andha yatandir'' . . .")</span> | ||
'''Indian man:''' Leadership is already in danger. <span style="color:# | '''Indian man:''' Leadership is already in danger. <span style="color:#ec710e">Ek cheez sarkar me ho raha hai. Kṛṣṇa bhagvan ne jab arjun ne dhanush ko rakh diya, ladai nahi karna chahte the dekhkarke ki hamare bandhu hain, jab nahi mane to Kṛṣṇa bole dekho ye sab mare hue hain . . . jo nimmit matra hai to wo nimmit matra arjun ke madhyam se kyo karaya gaya hai.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(There is one thing that is happening in the government. When Arjuna kept his bow and arrow down, he did not want to fight on seeing that the enemies were his relatives, when he did not accept then Kṛṣṇa said that they are all dead . . . one who is an instrument then why Arjuna made an instrument to kill his enemies.)</span> | ||
'''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Aapne isko samajh nahi sake. arjun hai kshtriya, kshatriya ka kaam kya hai. lekin ye jo vedic sabhyata hai brahman, kshatriya, vaisya, agar isko marna hai to brahman nahi marega, kshatriya marega. ab dekhiye Vishwamitra usko jungle me raat ko singh bada tang karti thee, to Vishwamitra ko power nahi tha ki usko marde. nahi wo aaye dashrath maharaj . . . "chatur varnyam maya shrishtam" jiska kaam hai wo kare. ye sab jo knowledge hamara bharat varsh me hai ki ye sab aaplog laat marke de diya aur apna-apna sab party me hain.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(You did not understand this. Arjuna is a ''ksatriya''. The duty of a ''ksatriya'' is what. But this vedic culture, ''brahmana'', ''ksatriya'', ''vaisya'', if they have to die then the ''brahmana'' will not kill, the ''ksatriya'' will kill. Now you see Viśvāmitra was troubled in the jungle at night by the tiger, but he did not have the power to kill it. No he came to Dasarath Mahārāja . . . "''catur varnyam maya sristam''" each has to do their own duty prescribed to them by the scriptures. All this knowledge what we have in India you have kicked it out and you are in your own parties.)</span> | ||
'''Indian man:''' <span style="color:# | '''Indian man:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Isiliye humlog sukhi nahi hain.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(That is why we are not happy.)</span> | ||
'''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Ho hi nahi sakta hai.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(We cannot be.)</span> | ||
'''Indian man:''' Inspite of all the best efforts . . . | '''Indian man:''' Inspite of all the best efforts . . . | ||
'''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Itna bhari knowledge hamara desh me hai usko band karke tala laga ke aur ant-shant baat karke sab khatam. duniya ko to gira diya na khud durpyog hain. ab yadi aaplog sudharna chahte hain to jab tak aaplog bolte hain hum Bhagavad-Gita padh liye . . .</span> We are preaching Bhagavad-Gita As It Is. <span style="color:#ec710e">Isme jo kuch dosh-gun hai (indistinct Hindi) Africa me jo hai na adivasi itna bada kaan wala... wo bhi nachta hai Hare Kṛṣṇa, yehi hamara mantra hai. usko Kṛṣṇa kya janta hai, Kṛṣṇa bhagvan kuch bhi janta hai wo bhi Hare Kṛṣṇa nachta hai.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Such vast knowledge is there in our country and we have locked it up and we talk all nonsense and finish. We have damaged the reputation of the country and we also are useless. Now if you want to rectify then until you say I have read ''Bhagavad-gita'' . . . whatever good and bad is there in it . . . (indistinct) . . . in Africa the big-eared tribals who are there . . . they also dance Hare Kṛṣṇa. They dance.)</span> | ||
Sita Ram Singh: So all, all over world . . . | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' So all, all over world . . . | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' All over the world. <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' All over the world. <span style="color:#ec710e">Aisa bhari movement bharatiya me. koi humko sahara nahi diya. America me humko peramanent residence diya hai. Humko hi nahi bahut sare indians ko diya hai. ye sab humko help karna hai na. Itna request karte hain. Ye politics . . . iske liye apsablog kuch help kijiye. Unka beechare kya dosh hai. aur iske bina hamara kaam kaise chalega itna bhari-bhari samsthan. Bahar ka to koi aata hi nahi isi ko lekarke kaam chala rahe hain. Koi aane se chalo . . . kya kare . . . 5-6 lakh rupaya barbad.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(This is a strong movement in India. Nobody supported us. In America they have given me permanent residence. Not only me but many Indians have been given permanent resident ship. They are all helping me. I request so much from the government. This is politics . . . so please you all help us. What is the fault of these innocent people and without them how will my work go on? such big big institutions, nobody comes from outside for help. So I am forced to take the help of these people. If somebody comes then okay . . . but what to do . . . 5 to 6 ''lakhs'' of rupees are wasted.</span> | ||
'''Indian man:''' <span style="color:# | '''Indian man:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Ye to kam-se-kam inlog ko . . . karna chahiye ki.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Those who are . . . this at least these people . . . they should do.)</span> | ||
'''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">They have been described as Hindu, "Hindu Americans." Wo idhar aate hain dharm sthan me Brindavan me aur usko bhago-bhago . . . nahi to young men aayenge hi nahi unko naukari mil jaye jagah mil jaye life settled. itna bada, vipatti. Ye jo sab banaye hain lakhon karod rupaya phir bhi udhar se le aate hain aur kam-se-kam 10 lakh rupaya mahawari hai. Ek aadmi kitab likhta hai aur inko bola jao becho, jao becho, bech ke rupaya le aao . . . are kam-se-kam jo assistant hai uske liye permanent residence de do, le lo, guarantee le lo.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(They come here to the place of pilgrimage, to Vṛndāvana and they are asked to go away, go away . . . then the young men will not come and if they get a job and a place to live, life will settle. Such a big problem. This ''lakhs'' and ''crores'' of rupees is what they have made, still they bring from there and 10 ''lakh'' rupees is the charge. One man writes books and they are told to go and sell, "Go sell, sell and bring us the money" . . . at least for the assistant . . . take the guarantee, take it.)</span> | ||
'''Indian man:''' <span style="color:# | '''Indian man:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">8-10 varsh, anti-national . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(8 to 10 years, anti-national . . .)</span> | ||
'''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Nahi kuch nahi.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(No nothing.)</span> | ||
'''Indian man (3):''' No, but is there any facility for getting Indian citizenship? | '''Indian man (3):''' No, but is there any facility for getting Indian citizenship? | ||
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'''Indian man (3):''' Then what is the difficulty? | '''Indian man (3):''' Then what is the difficulty? | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' Difficulty is . . . let them live here as permanent residents, just like I am American permanent resident. I am not citizen. If I like, I can become citizen. But what is the use of becoming citizen? It is as good as citizen. <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' Difficulty is . . . let them live here as permanent residents, just like I am American permanent resident. I am not citizen. If I like, I can become citizen. But what is the use of becoming citizen? It is as good as citizen. <span style="color:#ec710e">Permanent resident ko yearly ek report deta hai ki aap idhar hai.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(For the permanent resident, they issue an yearly report stating that you are residing here.)</span> | ||
Sita Ram Singh: <span style="color:# | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Jab visa expire ho jata hai,</span> <span style="color:#128807">(When the visa expires,)</span> within that period they have to go back. | ||
'''Indian man (3):''' . . . of extending the . . . | '''Indian man (3):''' . . . of extending the . . . | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Yes, of course, they have to go back, but . . . | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Yes, of course, they have to go back, but . . . | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' No, extension . . . <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' No, extension . . . <span style="color:#ec710e">wo teen mahine me aate hain aur teen mahine aur extension.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(they come for three months and then again extend for three months.)</span> Generally. | ||
'''Indian man (3):''' They don't give you this for permanent residentship | '''Indian man (3):''' They don't give you this for permanent residentship | ||
| Line 198: | Line 198: | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' No, no. No. | '''Prabhupāda:''' No, no. No. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: But this is amended . . . (indistinct Hindi) . . . this is amended. This must be amended. This should be brought to the knowledge of authorities. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' But this is amended . . . (indistinct Hindi) . . . this is amended. This must be amended. This should be brought to the knowledge of authorities. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">. . . itna strain hota hai.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(. . . there is so much of strain)</span> . . . (indistinct Hindi) | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Why do they not allow them to stay to serve the mission? | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Why do they not allow them to stay to serve the mission? | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' So we have no . . . we don't think anything in the . . . | '''Prabhupāda:''' So we have no . . . we don't think anything in the . . . | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Rajbhai Sampatte, he's a religious-minded man. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Rajbhai Sampatte, he's a religious-minded man. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Aaplog boliye thoda . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(You people also put in a word . . .)</span> | ||
Sita Ram Singh: And he should make a point. But the case should be just signed. Of course, a mandate of residency of your admission should also be . . . | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' And he should make a point. But the case should be just signed. Of course, a mandate of residency of your admission should also be . . . | ||
'''Indian man (3):''' Could the government not do the such and such . . . | '''Indian man (3):''' Could the government not do the such and such . . . | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Bahut hazaar . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Many thousands . . .)</span> | ||
Sita Ram Singh: So he came elected. Because he's in power, Rajbhai is in power, whatever he has got . . . | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' So he came elected. Because he's in power, Rajbhai is in power, whatever he has got . . . | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' But who will induce him to give up? | '''Prabhupāda:''' But who will induce him to give up? | ||
| Line 224: | Line 224: | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' He can do everything, but who will induce him to do? | '''Prabhupāda:''' He can do everything, but who will induce him to do? | ||
Sita Ram Singh: I don't know when I shall go to Delhi again, but in case if I go, I will bear it in mind. But meanwhile, I shall humbly request you that some of persons of your mission should also go and should bring him here so that he can find out a time to come to this mission. And because after seeing the all activities of the mission he may be rather much more convinced of the fact that this resolution should be abolished. It is a special case. For the missionary purpose this should be abolished. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' I don't know when I shall go to Delhi again, but in case if I go, I will bear it in mind. But meanwhile, I shall humbly request you that some of persons of your mission should also go and should bring him here so that he can find out a time to come to this mission. And because after seeing the all activities of the mission he may be rather much more convinced of the fact that this resolution should be abolished. It is a special case. For the missionary purpose this should be abolished. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Missionary visa bhi dete hain. PPardeshi ko deta hai baki ye bhi to pardeshi hai but because he's Vaiṣṇava, he'll not get.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Otherwise also they give missionary visas. They give it to outsiders but these people are also outsiders,)</span> but because he is a Vaisnava he will not get. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: You say seven ''lakhs'' of rupees are unnecessarily used every year. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' You say seven ''lakhs'' of rupees are unnecessarily used every year. | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' And just now I have got news. We have got a branch in Ceylon. So we thought that instead of going back to U.S.A. or Europe, let him go to Ceylon and renew the visa. So I hear that they have been forbidden, not to issue visa to our boys. <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' And just now I have got news. We have got a branch in Ceylon. So we thought that instead of going back to U.S.A. or Europe, let him go to Ceylon and renew the visa. So I hear that they have been forbidden, not to issue visa to our boys. <span style="color:#ec710e">Abhi tak to Indira Gandhi ka netagiri chal raha tha abhi to . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Until now Indira Gandhi's leadership was there but now . . .)</span> | ||
Sita Ram Singh: . . . (indistinct Hindi) | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' . . . (indistinct Hindi) | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupāda:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Uska policy wohi tha. Baki wohi constitution . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Her policy was the same. In fact she . . . constitution . . .)</span> | ||
Sita Ram Singh: <span style="color:# | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Constitution to wohi hai.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(The constitution is the same.)</span> Rather, the Constitution is molded from bad to worse. This point should be raised. I have got belief on that. So this money . . | ||
'''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Anek badha vighna . . . aur udhar se kuch nahi hoga . . . (indistinct) . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Many obstacles and hurdles came . . . and nothing is happening from that side . . . (indistinct) . . .)</span> | ||
Sita Ram Singh: When I go next time to Delhi I shall write letter. I have got address of this mission here. I shall write a letter here, and one of the representatives will go. I will give that . . . | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' When I go next time to Delhi I shall write letter. I have got address of this mission here. I shall write a letter here, and one of the representatives will go. I will give that . . . | ||
'''Prabhupāda:''' No, you can speak to Mr. Vajpayi. He is in charge of foreigners. That day I spoke. | '''Prabhupāda:''' No, you can speak to Mr. Vajpayi. He is in charge of foreigners. That day I spoke. | ||
Sita Ram Singh: Let the election be over. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' Let the election be over. | ||
'''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:# | '''Prabhupada:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Kya dosh hai uska. Wo tumhara ek pasia bhi khayega nahi.</span> <span style="color:#128807">(What is his fault? He will not take even a single paisa from you.)</span> | ||
'''Indian man (3):''' <span style="color:# | '''Indian man (3):''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Abhi to election ho raha hai uske baad is mamle ko . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(Now elections are going on after that we shall take up this matter . . .)</span> | ||
Sita Ram Singh: This matter can be brought before Vajpayi because he is charge of foreign affairs . . . you have got this culture. | '''Sita Ram Singh:''' This matter can be brought before Vajpayi because he is charge of foreign affairs . . . you have got this culture. | ||
'''Indian man:''' <span style="color:# | '''Indian man:''' <span style="color:#ec710e">Permanent resident ko koi . . . agar rehna chahta hai</span> <span style="color:#128807">(No one can remove permanent resident . . . if he wants to stay.)</span> If somebody is living here <span style="color:#ec710e">agar aap usko to theek hai . . .</span> <span style="color:#128807">(if you can . . . then it is alright)</span> Rules need certain ammendment . . . (indistinct Hindi) (end) | ||
Latest revision as of 04:49, 7 February 2024
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada
(Conversation with M.P. Shri Sita Ram Singh)
Sita Ram Singh: I came from Delhi. I got down here: "I want holy darśanas."
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
Sita Ram Singh: He told me, "He's not keeping good health . . ." "Of course, I won't speak to him, but simply I will have his darśana." Because you are superhuman being . . . (Prabhupāda chuckles) Everyone wants a blessing of persons like you. What you have done, and to remember these things . . . one feels himself satisfied only after having your darśana. You do me this favor . . .
Prabhupāda: You . . . you belong to Delhi?
Sita Ram Singh: No, I belong to Bihar. I come from the constituency of the . . . (indistinct). On the way I got down here, and I was so fortunate I got darśana. Mathura . . . (indistinct) . . . told me, "You can have your prasāda here." But "I shall take a part of prasāda." But the prasāda what I want, I want darśana. And if you have got any sympathy for me, kindly . . .
Prabhupāda: I have got sympathy for everyone.
Sita Ram Singh: Ah, yes.
Prabhupāda: Unfortunately, nobody cares to hear.
Sita Ram Singh: That's right.
Prabhupāda: They have their own program. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānāḥ (SB 7.5.31). Blind men leading blind men. You realize that your Constitution is defective?
Sita Ram Singh: Yes, of course.
Prabhupāda: Then what is the use of changing? The same instrument . . . so our proposal is that unless the limbs are perfect, the end cannot be perfect. So we are presenting, therefore, the limbs of Bhagavad-gītā, perfect, everything. But they are manufacturing their own way. There are so many parties—Ch.D. D.A.C. Ph.D . . .
Sita Ram Singh: (laughs) All they have got is party for their own selfish end. Actually it's taking north to south. Though I belong toward the party, but I must . . . (indistinct) . . . because they have all got their own selfish aims.
Prabhupāda: They are interested to keep the new position of the party. Who is thinking of the public? Public is in the same distressed condition.
Sita Ram Singh: Same distressed.
Prabhupāda: Rather, they are more distressed. Take, for example, in our childhood my father's income was, utmost, three hundred rupees. So we were not very rich men, but we had no want. Father was maintaining his family, getting children married, distributing the wealth. Everything very nice. And we never felt any want. In this mango season, because father thought it that "There must be a full basket of mangoes daily for the children," so we were jumping, playing and eating mangoes. And now, taking consideration of gold standard . . . at that time my mother was purchasing gold, twenty rupees . . .
Sita Ram Singh: Per tolā.
Prabhupāda: Twenty-two rupees. Now the same gold is six hundred rupees. So three hundred times more?
Sita Ram Singh: Yes.
Prabhupāda: If my father's income was three hundred rupees, increased by three hundred, it becomes nine thousand. So where is the nine-thousand-rupees income for a middle-class man?
Sita Ram Singh: Quite.
Prabhupāda: Nine thousand rupees', ten thousand rupees' income is for very, very big man. But comparing, say, sixty, seventy years ago, we were a middle-class man. So a middle-class man has not increased his income from three hundred rupees to ten thousand rupees. That means everybody has become poor. So where is the advancement? Simply beating the drum, will this . . .? In our childhood we have seen mustard oil, first class, made in Kanpur. We were purchasing, eight annas per two and a half ser.
Sita Ram Singh: And now it has gone thirteen rupees.
Prabhupāda: Thirteen rupees.
Sita Ram Singh: Thirteen rupees in our time.
Prabhupāda: Ghee, first-class ghee, we were purchasing, one rupee, Vardwa ghee. Now what is the price of ghee?
Indian man (1): Twenty-five.
Sita Ram Singh: Twenty rupees.
Indian man (1): Twenty, twenty-five. Between twenty and twenty-five, depending upon the place.
Prabhupāda: That means between twenty-five to thirty times, the price has increased. But income has not increased.
Indian man (1): Not in the real sense.
Prabhupāda: No sense. All nonsense.
Indian man (1): No sense. Not at all.
Sita Ram Singh: No sense. No sense at all.
Prabhupāda: Simply nonsense. So what is remedy? Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās te 'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ (SB 7.5.31). All over the world . . . of course, we do not want to criticize, but according to śāstra, people will suffer more and more. And they must suffer, because they are becoming godless. They must suffer. That is nature's punishment.
- daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī
- mama māyā duratyayā
- mām eva ye prapadyante
- māyām etāṁ
- (BG 7.14)
They won't take the real culture given by God Himself, Kṛṣṇa, "Do like this." Therefore they are godless. They must suffer. Now the suffering is awaiting to the general mass of people. Durbhikṣa . . . anāvṛṣṭi-durbhikṣa-kara-pīḍitāḥ (SB 12.2.9). There will be no rain from the sky, and therefore there will be no sufficient grains. Anāvṛṣṭi-durbhikṣa. And in the name of improving the situation, government will tax. Kara-pīḍitāḥ. In this way, so the people in general, they'll be so much harassed that without being able to manage things . . . ācchinna-dāra-draviṇā gacchanti giri-kānanam. "Let whatever I may have to the family eating. Let me go." This is the position.
Sita Ram Singh: What will be the future of India?
Prabhupāda: This will be future. Anywhere. Why you are speaking of India? What is spoken in the śāstra, that is not for India or for Bihar. It is for everywhere.
Sita Ram Singh: And the situation is going from bad to worse. Will it go . . .
Prabhupāda: Yes. And at the end there will be no wheat, no rice, no sugar, no milk, and you'll have to eat . . . I shall eat your flesh; you shall eat my flesh. They are eating already fetus of their own sons. What is that?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In some countries in the West . . .
Prabhupāda: Do they not?
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In some countries in the West they perform this operation for . . . what do they call it?
Indian man (1): Abortion.
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Abortion. They have legalized abortion. So the unborn fetus, after it's aborted, they're eating as food.
Sita Ram Singh: They have devised also even in India also. I don't know about . . .
Prabhupāda: Therefore I said: "Why do you speak of this country?" This will happen everywhere.
Sita Ram Singh: Is tarah agar pāpa hoga, (If this kind of sin happens,) then how one can expect betterment of the nation?
Prabhupāda: Pāpa? Paap to kuch suna hi nahi. (Haven't heard of sin.) Itna paap hai. (There is so much sin.) Prakṛteḥ kriya . . . (BG 3.27)
Indian man (1): Is there any way out?
Prabhupāda: Where the Kṛṣṇa consciousness . . . why don't you come? You'll not come. You'll stick to your own principle. Here is the way out: mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti (BG 7.14). "No." You'll make your own party, that's all, and suffer. What can be done? You'll never take good advice from Kṛṣṇa. You'll take advice from Indira Gandhi. That's it. (indistinct Hindi) And discontentment. Ye sab kuch hai hi nahi . . . "andha yatandir" bolne se thoda apradhi ho jata hai. baat hi aisa andha andhe ko chalayeg. (All this is not there . . . "Andha yatandir." Just by saying . . . this is a fact. A blind man leads another blind man.) Durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ durāśayā ye bahir-artha-māninaḥ (SB 7.5.31). They are trying to adjust things by the external nature. Bahut si baatein hain wo samajhna hi nahi chahte hain.aur samjhane se wo bigad jate hain. (There are many facts which they don't want to understand and if we try to explain to them they get angry.) Mūrkhāyopadeṣo hi prakopāya na. Unko rehna hi to hai. (They need to stay in something.) Come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness and be happy.
Sita Ram Singh: . . . shuru se hi hai uski, raasta to . . . (. . . from the beginning it is, the path . . .)
Prabhupāda: Are shuru se nahi abhi se hi karo na. Shuru jo ho gaya. mistake to . . . hi nahi ye kaun si baat hai. han mistake agar hua hai to usko mano aur sudhar karo. Nahi hamara mistake hi chalta hai. Chalo. Bhagvan to ye hi batate hai na ki koi baat nahi jo kuch ho gaya "sarva dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja aham tvam sarva papebhyo" paap to jaroor hua hai itna mistake kiya hai itna badmashi kiya hai, (Oh no from the beginning, start it right now, now that it has started. Mistakes have happened . . . what logic is this? If a mistake has happened, then accept it and rectify it. No, my mistake is going on, okay. God says whatever has happened in the past, forget it: "Sarva dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja aham tvam sarva papebhy." So many mistakes you have done, so much mischief you have done.) "I will explain." And "Who cares for you?" Are chalega Kṛṣṇa bhagvan hain, hum bhagvan hain . . . (indistinct) . . . mudha "na mam dushkritino mudha prapadyante nara dhama" atyant naradhama, maha papi wo bhagvan ke bare me bata raha hai. bade-bade vidwan hain " maya aparhta jyana" sab moorkh hi hain. aur thoda jo ABCD seekha hai wo bhi maya cheen liya. Kyu aasuri bhava . . . (indistinct) . . . (It is okay Kṛṣṇa is God, I am also God . . . (indistinct) . . . fools. "Na mam duskritino mudha prapadyante naradhama." Completely fallen, very sinful and he is talking about god. They are all great scholars, "Maya apahrta jnana." All are fools and whatever little education one has, ABCD, that also is taken away by illusion. Why this demoniac mentality? . . . (indistinct) . . .)
Indian man: Jo kans ka dasha hua wo hi dasha ho raha hai. (The condition in which Kamsa was, in that same condition we are all in.)
Prabhupada: Hoga hi. are bhai nature's law apko chodega nahi, aap chahe kitne pehalwan hain . (It will happen. Hey brother nature's law will not spare you no matter how strong a wrestler you are.) Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27) . . . (indistinct) . . . ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate. He is a rascal who is thinking, "I am independent." Rascal number one. Everyone is thinking, "Ah! I am independent." What is their independence? Hmm? Yehi moorkhta hai. sunega nahi, accha baat bolne se (verse) morrrkh ko upadesh dene se vo . . . kya karen. (break) humlog to mission start kiya to aaiye bhagvan jo bolta hai wo suniye na. ... ye Chaitanya Mahaprabhu ka mission hai. Sab guru ban jao. Chaitanya Mahaprabhu ka ye aadesh hai "ab to Bihar ya bangala sab ek hi hai. Chaitanya Mahaprbhu ka mission hai, wo keh rahe hain "amar agnya guru hoiya taro yei desh" jo desh me, gaon me, family me. (It will happen. Nature's law will not spare you how ever strong you are . . . (indistinct) . . . this is foolishness. He will not listen if you tell something good. (verse) If you preach to a foolish man he . . . what to do? We started the mission inviting everyone to come and listen to what god has to say . . . this is the mission of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Everyone must become a preacher. This is the order of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. "Now Bihar and Bengal are the same. This is the mission of Caitanya Mahāprabhu. He is saying: "Amar abnya guru haiya taro yei desh." In the country, in the village, in the family, in the community. ) We are preaching Bhagavad-gītā As It Is . . . compromise and interpretation . . .
community mepaida hokar aaya hai uske saath pyar karo guru banke, ye Chaitanya Mahaprabhu kahe hain "hamar agnya guru haiya taro ye desh" sara duniya me ghoomna nahi padega,wohi to jiska jaisa capacity hai . . . to wo kah sakta hai ki hum guru kasie ban jaye hume to kuch maloom hi nahi hai.. koi parvah nahi. guru banana bahut saral hai. kasie "jaro dakho tare kaho Kṛṣṇa upadesh" Kṛṣṇa jo bol diya hai bus usko suna do. itna simple hai. Ye nahi ki sona, magic dikhao . . . thagao, ye guru nahi, ye hai chor. krishan jo bataya hai usko sunana hai, ye koi mushkil hai kya. wo to Gita me likha usko thoda sa bol dena hai, wo guru ho gaya. ye jo sab pardeshi sab aaye hain wo kya sona banaye hai, magic dikhaye hain, bol diya dekho ji "krsnas tu bhagvan swayam"... Kṛṣṇa kehta hain "man mana mad bhakto mad yaji mam namaskuru"... "mam hi parth vyapashritya . . ." koi baat nahi paapi yoni hai to kya hua . . . (indistinct) . . . Kṛṣṇa jo bol raha hai usko laat mar kar phek diya aur jo moorkh bol diya usko le lo. are purva janma nahi badmashi hai isi janm ka. purva janm kyo jaate hain. isi janm ka badmashi dekho na uska phal bhogo na. itna door jane ka kya zaroorat hai. Gita me shuru hua hai "dharma kshetre kurukshetre sam veta yuyutsavah" ye jo ladai karne ke liye do party ikkhate hue hain, ye ladia karne ke liye, non-violence, uska arth, kitna bada badmashi, boliye. (He is born in the community so deal with him with love by becoming his spiritual master. This Caitanya Mahāprabhu is saying amar ajnya guru haiya taro ye desh—you don't have to roam around in the world, depends on the capacity then he can say how can I become a master when I don't know anything. Does not matter. To become a master is very simple. How jare dekho tare kaho Kṛṣṇa upadesh—whatever Kṛṣṇa has told just repeat it, so simple. Not that you show some magic, bring gold, or cheat people, this is not master, this is cheater. Whatever Kṛṣṇa has told just tell. Where is the difficulty in this? It is written in the Gītā, you have to say that and you become a spiritual master. All these foreigners who have come they have not shown magic, not brought gold, they simply say krsnas tu bhagavan swayam. Kṛṣṇa says: "man mana bhava mad bhakto mad yaji mam namaskuru mam hi parth vyapashrityah" does not matter if he is a sinner . . . (indistinct) . . . what Kṛṣṇa is saying you ignore that and accept what a fool is saying. This is not the result of previous karma but is the mischief of this life. Why do you go to the previous life, suffer the results of reactions of your karma in this life. Why do you go so far. In Gītā it starts with "dharma kshetre kurukshetre sam veta yuyutsavah"—the two armies are on the battlefield to fight, to battle, non-violence, what is the meaning of this, such foolishness is it not.)
Indian man: Tumhara Kṛṣṇa bhagvan dekh rahe hain. Arjun jab . . . (Your Kṛṣṇa is watching. When Arjun . . .)
Prabhupada: Are aap pehle dekhiye. ye jo words hai "dharma kshetre...." yuyutsava ka arth kya hota hai, boliye. ladia karna, aur ladai karne ke liye sab ikkhata hue hain aur non-violence. ye koi arth hai. (indistinct Hindi) doosre ko badnami karna hai aur khu bhi. usko sab sudhariye, tab apka leadership . . . nahi to "andha yatandir . . ." (You see first these words "Dharma kshetre . . ." yuyutsava what is the meaning of this, tell. To fight and to battle they have all gathered and to speak of non-violence. Is there any meaning in this . . . (indistinct) . . . to defame others and also to get a bad name for oneself. Rectify all this, then your leadership . . . otherwise "andha yatandir . . .")
Indian man: Leadership is already in danger. Ek cheez sarkar me ho raha hai. Kṛṣṇa bhagvan ne jab arjun ne dhanush ko rakh diya, ladai nahi karna chahte the dekhkarke ki hamare bandhu hain, jab nahi mane to Kṛṣṇa bole dekho ye sab mare hue hain . . . jo nimmit matra hai to wo nimmit matra arjun ke madhyam se kyo karaya gaya hai. (There is one thing that is happening in the government. When Arjuna kept his bow and arrow down, he did not want to fight on seeing that the enemies were his relatives, when he did not accept then Kṛṣṇa said that they are all dead . . . one who is an instrument then why Arjuna made an instrument to kill his enemies.)
Prabhupada: Aapne isko samajh nahi sake. arjun hai kshtriya, kshatriya ka kaam kya hai. lekin ye jo vedic sabhyata hai brahman, kshatriya, vaisya, agar isko marna hai to brahman nahi marega, kshatriya marega. ab dekhiye Vishwamitra usko jungle me raat ko singh bada tang karti thee, to Vishwamitra ko power nahi tha ki usko marde. nahi wo aaye dashrath maharaj . . . "chatur varnyam maya shrishtam" jiska kaam hai wo kare. ye sab jo knowledge hamara bharat varsh me hai ki ye sab aaplog laat marke de diya aur apna-apna sab party me hain. (You did not understand this. Arjuna is a ksatriya. The duty of a ksatriya is what. But this vedic culture, brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, if they have to die then the brahmana will not kill, the ksatriya will kill. Now you see Viśvāmitra was troubled in the jungle at night by the tiger, but he did not have the power to kill it. No he came to Dasarath Mahārāja . . . "catur varnyam maya sristam" each has to do their own duty prescribed to them by the scriptures. All this knowledge what we have in India you have kicked it out and you are in your own parties.)
Indian man: Isiliye humlog sukhi nahi hain. (That is why we are not happy.)
Prabhupada: Ho hi nahi sakta hai. (We cannot be.)
Indian man: Inspite of all the best efforts . . .
Prabhupada: Itna bhari knowledge hamara desh me hai usko band karke tala laga ke aur ant-shant baat karke sab khatam. duniya ko to gira diya na khud durpyog hain. ab yadi aaplog sudharna chahte hain to jab tak aaplog bolte hain hum Bhagavad-Gita padh liye . . . We are preaching Bhagavad-Gita As It Is. Isme jo kuch dosh-gun hai (indistinct Hindi) Africa me jo hai na adivasi itna bada kaan wala... wo bhi nachta hai Hare Kṛṣṇa, yehi hamara mantra hai. usko Kṛṣṇa kya janta hai, Kṛṣṇa bhagvan kuch bhi janta hai wo bhi Hare Kṛṣṇa nachta hai. (Such vast knowledge is there in our country and we have locked it up and we talk all nonsense and finish. We have damaged the reputation of the country and we also are useless. Now if you want to rectify then until you say I have read Bhagavad-gita . . . whatever good and bad is there in it . . . (indistinct) . . . in Africa the big-eared tribals who are there . . . they also dance Hare Kṛṣṇa. They dance.)
Sita Ram Singh: So all, all over world . . .
Prabhupāda: All over the world. Aisa bhari movement bharatiya me. koi humko sahara nahi diya. America me humko peramanent residence diya hai. Humko hi nahi bahut sare indians ko diya hai. ye sab humko help karna hai na. Itna request karte hain. Ye politics . . . iske liye apsablog kuch help kijiye. Unka beechare kya dosh hai. aur iske bina hamara kaam kaise chalega itna bhari-bhari samsthan. Bahar ka to koi aata hi nahi isi ko lekarke kaam chala rahe hain. Koi aane se chalo . . . kya kare . . . 5-6 lakh rupaya barbad. (This is a strong movement in India. Nobody supported us. In America they have given me permanent residence. Not only me but many Indians have been given permanent resident ship. They are all helping me. I request so much from the government. This is politics . . . so please you all help us. What is the fault of these innocent people and without them how will my work go on? such big big institutions, nobody comes from outside for help. So I am forced to take the help of these people. If somebody comes then okay . . . but what to do . . . 5 to 6 lakhs of rupees are wasted.
Indian man: Ye to kam-se-kam inlog ko . . . karna chahiye ki. (Those who are . . . this at least these people . . . they should do.)
Prabhupada: They have been described as Hindu, "Hindu Americans." Wo idhar aate hain dharm sthan me Brindavan me aur usko bhago-bhago . . . nahi to young men aayenge hi nahi unko naukari mil jaye jagah mil jaye life settled. itna bada, vipatti. Ye jo sab banaye hain lakhon karod rupaya phir bhi udhar se le aate hain aur kam-se-kam 10 lakh rupaya mahawari hai. Ek aadmi kitab likhta hai aur inko bola jao becho, jao becho, bech ke rupaya le aao . . . are kam-se-kam jo assistant hai uske liye permanent residence de do, le lo, guarantee le lo. (They come here to the place of pilgrimage, to Vṛndāvana and they are asked to go away, go away . . . then the young men will not come and if they get a job and a place to live, life will settle. Such a big problem. This lakhs and crores of rupees is what they have made, still they bring from there and 10 lakh rupees is the charge. One man writes books and they are told to go and sell, "Go sell, sell and bring us the money" . . . at least for the assistant . . . take the guarantee, take it.)
Indian man: 8-10 varsh, anti-national . . . (8 to 10 years, anti-national . . .)
Prabhupada: Nahi kuch nahi. (No nothing.)
Indian man (3): No, but is there any facility for getting Indian citizenship?
Prabhupāda: No, no, no. We don't want citizenship. What they will do with citizen . . . Indian citi . . .?
Indian man (3): Then what is the difficulty?
Prabhupāda: Difficulty is . . . let them live here as permanent residents, just like I am American permanent resident. I am not citizen. If I like, I can become citizen. But what is the use of becoming citizen? It is as good as citizen. Permanent resident ko yearly ek report deta hai ki aap idhar hai. (For the permanent resident, they issue an yearly report stating that you are residing here.)
Sita Ram Singh: Jab visa expire ho jata hai, (When the visa expires,) within that period they have to go back.
Indian man (3): . . . of extending the . . .
Sita Ram Singh: Yes, of course, they have to go back, but . . .
Prabhupāda: No, extension . . . wo teen mahine me aate hain aur teen mahine aur extension. (they come for three months and then again extend for three months.) Generally.
Indian man (3): They don't give you this for permanent residentship
Prabhupāda: No.
Indian man (3) that you can stay even, say, for two years, four years, five years not of that sort
Prabhupāda: No, no. No.
Sita Ram Singh: But this is amended . . . (indistinct Hindi) . . . this is amended. This must be amended. This should be brought to the knowledge of authorities.
Prabhupāda: . . . itna strain hota hai. (. . . there is so much of strain) . . . (indistinct Hindi)
Sita Ram Singh: Why do they not allow them to stay to serve the mission?
Prabhupāda: So we have no . . . we don't think anything in the . . .
Sita Ram Singh: Rajbhai Sampatte, he's a religious-minded man.
Prabhupāda: Aaplog boliye thoda . . . (You people also put in a word . . .)
Sita Ram Singh: And he should make a point. But the case should be just signed. Of course, a mandate of residency of your admission should also be . . .
Indian man (3): Could the government not do the such and such . . .
Prabhupāda: Bahut hazaar . . . (Many thousands . . .)
Sita Ram Singh: So he came elected. Because he's in power, Rajbhai is in power, whatever he has got . . .
Prabhupāda: But who will induce him to give up?
Indian man (3): If he can . . . he can relax it.
Prabhupāda: He can do everything, but who will induce him to do?
Sita Ram Singh: I don't know when I shall go to Delhi again, but in case if I go, I will bear it in mind. But meanwhile, I shall humbly request you that some of persons of your mission should also go and should bring him here so that he can find out a time to come to this mission. And because after seeing the all activities of the mission he may be rather much more convinced of the fact that this resolution should be abolished. It is a special case. For the missionary purpose this should be abolished.
Prabhupāda: Missionary visa bhi dete hain. PPardeshi ko deta hai baki ye bhi to pardeshi hai but because he's Vaiṣṇava, he'll not get. (Otherwise also they give missionary visas. They give it to outsiders but these people are also outsiders,) but because he is a Vaisnava he will not get.
Sita Ram Singh: You say seven lakhs of rupees are unnecessarily used every year.
Prabhupāda: And just now I have got news. We have got a branch in Ceylon. So we thought that instead of going back to U.S.A. or Europe, let him go to Ceylon and renew the visa. So I hear that they have been forbidden, not to issue visa to our boys. Abhi tak to Indira Gandhi ka netagiri chal raha tha abhi to . . . (Until now Indira Gandhi's leadership was there but now . . .)
Sita Ram Singh: . . . (indistinct Hindi)
Prabhupāda: Uska policy wohi tha. Baki wohi constitution . . . (Her policy was the same. In fact she . . . constitution . . .)
Sita Ram Singh: Constitution to wohi hai. (The constitution is the same.) Rather, the Constitution is molded from bad to worse. This point should be raised. I have got belief on that. So this money . .
Prabhupada: Anek badha vighna . . . aur udhar se kuch nahi hoga . . . (indistinct) . . . (Many obstacles and hurdles came . . . and nothing is happening from that side . . . (indistinct) . . .)
Sita Ram Singh: When I go next time to Delhi I shall write letter. I have got address of this mission here. I shall write a letter here, and one of the representatives will go. I will give that . . .
Prabhupāda: No, you can speak to Mr. Vajpayi. He is in charge of foreigners. That day I spoke.
Sita Ram Singh: Let the election be over.
Prabhupada: Kya dosh hai uska. Wo tumhara ek pasia bhi khayega nahi. (What is his fault? He will not take even a single paisa from you.)
Indian man (3): Abhi to election ho raha hai uske baad is mamle ko . . . (Now elections are going on after that we shall take up this matter . . .)
Sita Ram Singh: This matter can be brought before Vajpayi because he is charge of foreign affairs . . . you have got this culture.
Indian man: Permanent resident ko koi . . . agar rehna chahta hai (No one can remove permanent resident . . . if he wants to stay.) If somebody is living here agar aap usko to theek hai . . . (if you can . . . then it is alright) Rules need certain ammendment . . . (indistinct Hindi) (end)
- 1977 - Conversations
- 1977 - Lectures and Conversations
- 1977 - Lectures, Conversations and Letters
- 1977-05 - Conversations and Letters
- Conversations - India
- Conversations - India, Vrndavana
- Conversations with Public Officials
- Lectures, Conversations and Letters - India
- Lectures, Conversations and Letters - India, Vrndavana
- Conversations and Lectures with Bengali Snippets
- Conversations and Lectures with Hindi Snippets
- Conversations and Lectures with both Bengali and Hindi Snippets
- Audio Files 30.01 to 45.00 Minutes
- 1977 - New Audio - Released in July 2012