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730228 - Conversation A - Jakarta: Difference between revisions

(Created page with '{{CV_Header|{{PAGENAME}}}} <div class="code">730228RC.JKT</div> <p>Guest (1): ...he was born in Tokyo.</p> <p>Prabhupāda: We have got our friends in Tokyo.</p> <p>Guest (1): (…')
 
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[[Category:1973 - Conversations]]
<div class="code">730228RC.JKT</div>
[[Category:1973 - Lectures and Conversations]]
[[Category:1973 - Lectures, Conversations and Letters]]
[[Category:1973-02 - Lectures, Conversations and Letters]]
[[Category:Conversations - Asia]]
[[Category:Conversations - Asia, Indonesia - Jakarta]]
[[Category:Lectures, Conversations and Letters - Asia]]
[[Category:Lectures, Conversations and Letters - Asia, Indonesia - Jakarta]]
[[Category:1973 - New Audio - Released in May 2015]]
[[Category:Audio Files 20.01 to 30.00 Minutes]]
<div style="float:left">[[File:Go-previous.png|link=Category:Conversations - by Date]]'''[[:Category:Conversations - by Date|Conversations by Date]], [[:Category:1973 - Conversations|1973]]'''</div>
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*This was previously [[730228 - Conversation B - Jakarta]]


<p>Guest (1): ...he was born in Tokyo.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: We have got our friends in Tokyo.</p>
<p>Guest (1): (Japanese)</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So you are trying to understand our philosophy, Kṛṣṇa consciousness?</p>
<p>Guest (1): (Japanese) ...not in Japanese language. Now you have some Japanese language also?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Japanese people we have got.</p>
<p>Devotee: I don't have any but in Japan they have it. I can get it by post. I will write a letter.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So you like Kṛṣṇa? You like Kṛṣṇa?</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So you are staying here in Jakarta?</p>
<p>Guest (1): One year more. One year more. And I proceed to Beirut, Morocco. From Rabat, Morocco, I go to (indistinct) Frankfurt (indistinct)</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: We have got temple there.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Edinburgh.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: What is the address, Edinburgh?</p>
<p>Devotee: Scotland. The address is here, Flat No. 6, 11 Greenhill Place, Scotland, Edinburgh.</p>
<p>Guest (1): But only one year, I'll be. I'll go back to Tokyo. I have my house, Tokyo. At about 1980. Still I have my house, my mother (indistinct) small house there (indistinct) 1980, I go back.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: He has left Tokyo 1980?</p>
<p>Devotee: No. He said he is going back to Tokyo by 1980.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes. Go back Tokyo. My (indistinct) in Tokyo later. I left Tokyo '63 and go around India...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: You have been in India?</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes. Birla Mandir I stayed two years.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Birla Mandir. Delhi.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Delhi.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: I see.</p>
<p>Guest (1): And initiated, and (indistinct) by Radhaswami.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Ācchā.</p>
<p>Guest (1): And also see some Pondicherry, but never been (indistinct) this great river, Gaṅgā. (indistinct) Pondicherry (indistinct) evacuated...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: You stayed in India for two years?</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes, sir.</p>
<p>Guest (2): One year, one year in Pakistan, Lahore.</p>
<p>Guest (1): (indistinct) and only summer time evacuated because Lahore is north of it, Kashmir side. (indistinct) north.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda:Sir, you are by religion Mohammedan?</p>
<p>Guest (1): Pardon?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: By religion?</p>
<p>Guest (1): No. But I study Shintoism in Japan. (indistinct) This is the base of culture, Japanese culture (indistinct) the western modern civilization based on Descartes (indistinct) many gods and goddess...</p>
<p>Devotee: Shintoism is a very old Japanese religion, they have many worshiping of demigods and goddesses...</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes, the same, classic Greek mythology based on modern western civilization. And do you understand Japanese, all character (indistinct) ...logical study based on Shintoism basic of (indistinct) from south island (indistinct) and Mongolian (indistinct) one race (indistinct) one Japanese (indistinct) by Shintoism, world mythology, same as the Greek mythology, gods and (indistinct)</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: What you are doing here?</p>
<p>Guest (1): No program (indistinct) ...pension (indistinct)</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Get pension from Japan?</p>
<p>Guest (1): From Japan, twenty-five percent of salary. So it's not enough, same society, same society, salary time in Japan (indistinct) evacuation. I left, moreover, I have two (indistinct) in Tokyo (indistinct) by my mother and father. This is (indistinct) Before I had four—one wife and one only daughter but both (indistinct) passed away, and widower. So I was anywhere safe alone, widower, so I left Japan '63, for India first. (indistinct) Kabul, Peshawar and Tehran, Karachi and come here '66. Too long, (indistinct) easiest place to live, easiest places to live. But too long (indistinct) So I will leave from here maybe next year (indistinct) Alexandria, Egypt and from there along the south coast Mediterranean up to Rabat, Morocco. Before pre-war time I was several times (indistinct) Suez Canal (indistinct)</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: He has traveled all over the world.</p>
<p>Devotee: Yes. He has.</p>
<p>Guest (1): When my young period, young period.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: What is your age now?</p>
<p>Guest (1): Seventy-two. I like the ship, so old man prefers cheaper trip than air, (indistinct) so I take air from Indonesia (indistinct) only and take ship to Alexandria. (indistinct) From Alexandria to Morocco I take (indistinct) bus, big bus like Union Pacific before from east side the west side America, we take big bus (indistinct) four days only I arrive at (indistinct) Morocco. And maybe I cross to Andalusia, Spain, not near Madrid, Castillian (indistinct) again take ship from (indistinct) railway from Manchester to (indistinct) So still seven years I loitering. And this only to see old friend in Edinburgh, and I see old, old man (indistinct) I am also old man, not so long time, within one year I down, I never been South America, only up to Mexico so I go to (indistinct). And stay, I contracted only one contract three years but I want to work, job, one year, highest salary there so and finish I go to Argentina from Santiago Chile I take the ship again to, Sydney, my younger brother, Sydney and go back from (indistinct)</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: In Sydney also we have got temple.</p>
<p>Guest (1): (indistinct) Where?</p>
<p>Devotee: I can show you.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Australia's, find Australia's...</p>
<p>Guest (1): Australia, never. Only my younger brother....</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Australia, Sydney.</p>
<p>Devotee: We have a temple in Sydney, Australia.</p>
<p>Guest (1): And Edinburgh?</p>
<p>Devotee: 823 Hereford Street.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes, sir. So you have been already...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: You become one of the life members of our society and you can go anywhere and stay there.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Like Birla Mandir or āśrama in India, āśrama...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: In India, Calcutta, Bombay, Delhi have got branches.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes. Pondicherry, Rabindranath Ashram, Pondicherry. Nanda's Ashram(?), in Bangalore. Only Delhi I've been to āśrama (indistinct)</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: This is a cap, with this Japanese (indistinct)?</p>
<p>Guest (1): No, sir. National congress, national India. This is a (indistinct)</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Gandhi cap.</p>
<p>Devotee: Indian National Congress.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Indian National Congress Party, independent (indistinct) national pact with Indonesia ... hot.</p>
<p>Devotee: The Muslims wear the black one and he says it is very hot but this is cool.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Yes.</p>
<p>Guest (1): ...nearly bald head, I cover with this...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Nowadays gradually, everyone is giving up cap. First of all, only the Bengalis were the capless nation. Now gradually, it has spread all over the world. Nobody uses hats or cap.</p>
<p>Guest (1): We like the cover cap.</p>
<p>Guest (2): You don't shave?</p>
<p>Guest (1): You don't shave more (indistinct) only shaving clean shave only (indistinct)</p>
<p>Devotee: You are asking me?</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes.</p>
<p>Devotee: Yes. About every two weeks.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Every two weeks. What mean this symbol?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Flag. It is flag.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Flag? (indistinct) It is better to do like this?</p>
<p>Devotee: Yes.</p>
<p>Guest (1): And some Indian gentlemen only married here (indistinct) and...</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: This is temple. Temple.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes. Temple.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Lord's temple.</p>
<p>Devotee: The Lord's temple. Temple of God.</p>
<p>Guest (1): (Japanese)</p>
<p>Devotee: Yes.</p>
<p>Guest (1): This quite different Japanese, Asian sometimes but European made never like this only female, lady like this Europe.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No. It is sacred thread, sacred thread.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Amulet.</p>
<p>Devotee: Sacred thread.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Thread.</p>
<p>Devotee: Thread, sacred.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Sacred thread. Not army (indistinct) pendulum no, only thread, some sacrament or some special mysterious power.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Brahminical. Brahminical thread.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Brahma, brahminical.</p>
<p>Guest 3 Indonesian man: I explain. (Indonesian)</p>
<p>Guest (1): Every Hindu ...</p>
<p>Guest (3): Yes.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Hinduism (indistinct) in India. From where you get it?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: You can prepare it.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Prepare by yourself handmade.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: At home.</p>
<p>Guest (1): But some... why this come sacred?</p>
<p>Guest (3): (Indonesian)</p>
<p>Guest (1): ...ceremony, by some ceremony purification, sanctified needed like (indistinct) But this is not sacred yet. How do become sacred this thread?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: You have to give up this four prohibitives.</p>
<p>Guest (1): By sacrament?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: By taking vow not to indulge in four prohibitives.</p>
<p>Devotee: Oh. I'm not very expert yet.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: No, you can say it in English.</p>
<p>Devotee: Oh in English. We have a special private ceremony...</p>
<p>Guest (1): Ceremony.</p>
<p>Devotee: And we must take a vow of...</p>
<p>Guest (1): A vow?</p>
<p>Devotee: We agree. We must agree to stop certain sins. We...</p>
<p>Guest (1): Stop the sin you mean.</p>
<p>Devotee: Ya, ya, before.</p>
<p>Guest (1): (indistinct) hundred eight thing.</p>
<p>Devotee: Well, four basic sinning.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes.</p>
<p>Devotee: Meat-eating, eating meat, illicit sex, gambling and intoxication.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Toxication, yes.</p>
<p>Devotee: Alcohol and those things and we must... Every day we chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, sixteen times.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Sixteen times.</p>
<p>Devotee: On beads.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Yes, yes. Rosary. Rosary...</p>
<p>Devotee: After one year we may become initiated with this. And every day, three times, we use this for prayer, Gāyatrī mantra.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Three times. How many? One time? Pray for this? Pray for this?</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: Is this water or not?</p>
<p>Guest (1): Beads, beads, how many?</p>
<p>Devotee: This means that I have a spiritual master.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Spiritual master.</p>
<p>Devotee: Śrīla Prabhupāda is my spiritual master.</p>
<p>Guest (1): From master. Given by master to you.</p>
<p>Devotee: That's right.</p>
<p>Guest (1): So after at least one year later according some occupational training and devotion and can initiated, initiate. Not now.</p>
<p>Devotee: There's... No. There's first initiation and second initiation. First initiation means that you are able to chant sixteen rounds and follow those four rules.</p>
<p>Guest (1): Hm. Yes. Cardinal sins.</p>
<p>Devotee: Like that. After six months following then you get first initiation. After one more year, then you get this thread if you...</p>
<p>Guest (1): Oh yes.</p>
<p>Devotee: This is after one year. First initiation is after six months.</p>
<p>Guest (1): And this is...</p>
<p>Devotee: After one year.</p>
<p>Guest (1): ...like a special prize. This (indistinct) master. But this is essential and this initiation (indistinct) after novitiate.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: (indistinct) ...I'll go and take rest.</p>
<p>Devotee: O.K.</p>
<p>Prabhupāda: So he'll explain, I'm going to take rest.</p>
<p>Guest (1): O.K. (pause Śrīla Prabhupāda leaves and devotee and guest continue conversation about four regulative principles and so on)</p>


<div class="code">730228R1-JAKARTA - February 28, 1973 - 19:50 Minutes</div>


{{CV_Footer|{{PAGENAME}}}}
 
<mp3player>https://s3.amazonaws.com/vanipedia/full/1973/730228R1-JAKARTA.mp3</mp3player>
 
 
(poor audio—microphone too far away)
 
Prabhupāda: You learn this local language . . . (indistinct) . . . and try to take classes in . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: Mr. . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: Indian
 
Prabhupāda: He has written that poetry.
 
Amogha: Yes, yes. He's very nice. Actually he wants to become initiated, but he can't chant. The only thing, he doesn't chant rounds, and . . .
 
Prabhupāda: Why?
 
Amogha: He says that, "If I do that, I can't do my business," and he has many reasons. For some ten days he chanted sixteen rounds, and then he just stopped and couldn't, and now he doesn't chant at all. But he's very sincere. He works very hard.
 
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: I will tell him. I have told him many times. Actually it took a long time to get him to read your books, and then when he read, then we told him, "You must chant. You must . . . it takes time to . . ." He is very . . . "It takes time to agree."
 
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: Yes. The only problem is that in his community he's rejected.
 
Prabhupāda: Rejected? Why?
 
Amogha: Yes, because a few years ago his family left him— and his wife and children deserted him, and he . . . the wife told many stories about him, that he was very . . . doing degraded things, and so everyone rejects him. And when he speaks to Indian people, they reject. He irritates them. And also sometimes he is . . . it can be changed, but he is . . . he makes them irritated, a little too much pride. But he can be changed, because he's changing so much. But he tries very, very hard. Only we have to get him to agree to chant. And now he has another wife and a child.
 
Prabhupāda: A child?
 
Amogha: A child. Yes. One boy was born just before we came here in August, and he seems to be a devotee, the baby, because he . . . whenever you say: "Hare Kṛṣṇa," he smiles.
 
Prabhupāda: Then why he's not married, wife?
 
Amogha: Another wife, second.
 
Prabhupāda: Married.
 
Amogha: Yes, yes. He says it was a great mistake, because if we had come sooner, then he would not . . . so we will try to engage him. Also this girl which I want to initiate, she can speak a fair amount of Indonesian already, and she can help translation work and also preaching.
 
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: That girl has a sister who also chants sixteen rounds and follows the rules. But sometimes in her past she failed and stopped, and she is not as steady. So I didn't recommend. But I don't know . . .
 
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: That is better, because they're sisters, and if one is then the other is and the other is not then it is difficult. So I will learn Indonesian carefully.
 
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: Because also, even if someone is expert in English, if they don't practice or come in touch with Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then they still cannot say it.
 
Prabhupāda: My point is this change is . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: If Macmillan publishes ''Bhagavad-gītā'' in English, is there any difficulty for us to publish by another company in another language?
 
Prabhupāda: I don't know.
 
Amogha: I will ask about it.
 
Prabhupāda: Write immediately Karandhara. You want to publish books in Indonesian the national Language . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: The professor, head of the department of Sanskrit, University of Indonesia . . . now today coming. About 9:30 I made appointment, and if we could influence her also, then we will have some facility to preach in the university . . . (indistinct)
 
Those Bali Hindus are preparing very nicely for tomorrow morning. They want us to arrive at 7:30 in their temple, and many people will come, and they will honor you very nicely. They will bring the ''vyāsāsana'' all the way there.
 
Prabhupāda: Very good. Last night speaking . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: Actually, I think these Indian people are not very intelligent. Even we have preached to them over a year, and they say: "Yes, Swāmījī. Yes, Swāmījī. Yes, we understand." But they don't. And they're offering respect, but how much philosophy they can grasp? I don't think it's very much. But the younger ones, about ten, twelve, fifteen years old, they're very intelligent. There were some boys there also who used to come to our ''kīrtana''. And I remember how they grasped the philosophy before. They could repeat it. But they didn't remain steady. But in the future.
 
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: That is a problem in this Indian community. They are very . . . many kinds of envy. And their enviousness makes everyone . . . for example, we had ''kīrtana''. We were having every night, but many children told me that "I would like to come, but my parents won't let me come." Because they are saying gossip, rumors, things like this. This girl who we want to initiate, she would come every, every day, without fail, and her . . . even her parents would say: "Why are you going there? Everybody is talking about you." So socially they, maybe now they will change, but so far they are rejecting.
 
Śrutakīrti: That man yesterday . . . (indistinct) . . . he was saying in the newspaper, there's an article about us in the newspaper right here, that connected us with drugs.
 
Amogha: There's a magazine called ''Express'', like ''Time'' magazine, ''News'' magazine, and it says, "Attention to the intelligence agency of this country, that the leader of the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is coming here," and they should consider trying to stop you from coming here because it's possible this Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is connected with hippies and narcotics and things like this.
 
But tomorrow there is a reporter from ''Tempo'' magazine, which is better magazine, like ''Time'' or ''Newsweek''. And if we can get favorable article from him, then it will counteract. Before you came, it was announced in all of the newspapers. All of the newspapers, they announced that you were coming, before.
 
Prabhupāda: But after my coming they have not published it.
 
Amogha: Not yet. But one man came yesterday who was very interested, big local paper. And Associated Press International, the man in charge was in San Francisco for Ratha-yātrā, and he saw you there and took ''prasādam'' also. And he wants to take some color photographs for international coverage. I will invite him again. I think in Indonesia they're usually, they're a bit slow, so a week later they will publish.
 
Prabhupāda: (aside) Why do you keeping . . . (indistinct) . . . bag.
 
Devotee: I washed it this morning (bead bag?)
 
Prabhupāda: Why don't you keep two is it very scarcity? . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: You wrote a letter to me from Sydney in which you said that the printing program is very nice, but by your experience, it takes much time and money. And how will we do ''saṅkīrtana'' and do ''prasādam'' distribution and printing all at the same time? And you said: "You can think this over with a cool head, and we will discuss more when we come."
 
Prabhupāda: But first thing is that . . . (indistinct) . . . you are not yet so expert . . . (indistinct) . . . just like the other day wanted to speak something . . . (indistinct) . . . so at the present moment you cannot depend on your strength of understanding the language. So how we can make more . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: We can have translations from that girl's . . . (indistinct)
 
Prabhupāda: Yes that will . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: Only the translation we have done so far, some, it seems to me, not right. Although I can't read it, I've tried so many times to print it, but I can never get it printed. And it seems that if it was a good translation . . .
 
Prabhupāda: Why not . . . (indistinct) . . .? Translate each verse . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: Maybe on the street. Somebody wash clothes. Their standard of cleaning is very low. We can tell, because sometimes we ask their help to clean something, "Please make this very, very clean," and they . . . and it's not clean. There are intelligent people, though, in Jakarta. They have Theosophical Society with a large following, and there's many Buddhist people who are fairly intelligent.
 
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: Today is Wednesday. They meet on Thursday. I'll go see them today.
 
Prabhupāda: (indistinct) . . . sentimentalist, speculators . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: They meet at 6 o'clock, I think, and our meeting is 7 o'clock, so maybe I should invite them, because I don't think it would be time to go there. If you would like to stay a few more days, I can arrange many more meetings. (laughs)
 
Prabhupāda: (indistinct) . . . also they do not understand.
 
Amogha: In the Theosophical Society?
 
Prabhupāda: Yes.
 
Amogha: Yes. Not everyone, but one leader I spoke to, he understood, and he liked it very much.
 
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: I will call him.
 
(pause)
 
Prabhupāda: Good ''ḍāl'' is not available here?
 
Amogha:  Good ''ḍāl''?
 
Prabhupāda: The ''ḍāl'', it does not boil.
 
Amogha: It's not good. What kind of ''ḍāl'' did they offer you, to you?
 
Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)
 
Amogha: I'll ask Śrutakīrti. I must go and pick some flowers for the garland. (offers obeisances) Shall we go to the same place for the walk? It is too far away?
 
Prabhupāda: Yes. They will not allow . . . (indistinct) . . . (break) (end)

Revision as of 04:49, 19 May 2020

His Divine Grace
A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada



730228R1-JAKARTA - February 28, 1973 - 19:50 Minutes



(poor audio—microphone too far away)

Prabhupāda: You learn this local language . . . (indistinct) . . . and try to take classes in . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: Mr. . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: Indian

Prabhupāda: He has written that poetry.

Amogha: Yes, yes. He's very nice. Actually he wants to become initiated, but he can't chant. The only thing, he doesn't chant rounds, and . . .

Prabhupāda: Why?

Amogha: He says that, "If I do that, I can't do my business," and he has many reasons. For some ten days he chanted sixteen rounds, and then he just stopped and couldn't, and now he doesn't chant at all. But he's very sincere. He works very hard.

Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: I will tell him. I have told him many times. Actually it took a long time to get him to read your books, and then when he read, then we told him, "You must chant. You must . . . it takes time to . . ." He is very . . . "It takes time to agree."

Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: Yes. The only problem is that in his community he's rejected.

Prabhupāda: Rejected? Why?

Amogha: Yes, because a few years ago his family left him— and his wife and children deserted him, and he . . . the wife told many stories about him, that he was very . . . doing degraded things, and so everyone rejects him. And when he speaks to Indian people, they reject. He irritates them. And also sometimes he is . . . it can be changed, but he is . . . he makes them irritated, a little too much pride. But he can be changed, because he's changing so much. But he tries very, very hard. Only we have to get him to agree to chant. And now he has another wife and a child.

Prabhupāda: A child?

Amogha: A child. Yes. One boy was born just before we came here in August, and he seems to be a devotee, the baby, because he . . . whenever you say: "Hare Kṛṣṇa," he smiles.

Prabhupāda: Then why he's not married, wife?

Amogha: Another wife, second.

Prabhupāda: Married.

Amogha: Yes, yes. He says it was a great mistake, because if we had come sooner, then he would not . . . so we will try to engage him. Also this girl which I want to initiate, she can speak a fair amount of Indonesian already, and she can help translation work and also preaching.

Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: That girl has a sister who also chants sixteen rounds and follows the rules. But sometimes in her past she failed and stopped, and she is not as steady. So I didn't recommend. But I don't know . . .

Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: That is better, because they're sisters, and if one is then the other is and the other is not then it is difficult. So I will learn Indonesian carefully.

Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: Because also, even if someone is expert in English, if they don't practice or come in touch with Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then they still cannot say it.

Prabhupāda: My point is this change is . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: If Macmillan publishes Bhagavad-gītā in English, is there any difficulty for us to publish by another company in another language?

Prabhupāda: I don't know.

Amogha: I will ask about it.

Prabhupāda: Write immediately Karandhara. You want to publish books in Indonesian the national Language . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: The professor, head of the department of Sanskrit, University of Indonesia . . . now today coming. About 9:30 I made appointment, and if we could influence her also, then we will have some facility to preach in the university . . . (indistinct)

Those Bali Hindus are preparing very nicely for tomorrow morning. They want us to arrive at 7:30 in their temple, and many people will come, and they will honor you very nicely. They will bring the vyāsāsana all the way there.

Prabhupāda: Very good. Last night speaking . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: Actually, I think these Indian people are not very intelligent. Even we have preached to them over a year, and they say: "Yes, Swāmījī. Yes, Swāmījī. Yes, we understand." But they don't. And they're offering respect, but how much philosophy they can grasp? I don't think it's very much. But the younger ones, about ten, twelve, fifteen years old, they're very intelligent. There were some boys there also who used to come to our kīrtana. And I remember how they grasped the philosophy before. They could repeat it. But they didn't remain steady. But in the future.

Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: That is a problem in this Indian community. They are very . . . many kinds of envy. And their enviousness makes everyone . . . for example, we had kīrtana. We were having every night, but many children told me that "I would like to come, but my parents won't let me come." Because they are saying gossip, rumors, things like this. This girl who we want to initiate, she would come every, every day, without fail, and her . . . even her parents would say: "Why are you going there? Everybody is talking about you." So socially they, maybe now they will change, but so far they are rejecting.

Śrutakīrti: That man yesterday . . . (indistinct) . . . he was saying in the newspaper, there's an article about us in the newspaper right here, that connected us with drugs.

Amogha: There's a magazine called Express, like Time magazine, News magazine, and it says, "Attention to the intelligence agency of this country, that the leader of the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is coming here," and they should consider trying to stop you from coming here because it's possible this Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is connected with hippies and narcotics and things like this.

But tomorrow there is a reporter from Tempo magazine, which is better magazine, like Time or Newsweek. And if we can get favorable article from him, then it will counteract. Before you came, it was announced in all of the newspapers. All of the newspapers, they announced that you were coming, before.

Prabhupāda: But after my coming they have not published it.

Amogha: Not yet. But one man came yesterday who was very interested, big local paper. And Associated Press International, the man in charge was in San Francisco for Ratha-yātrā, and he saw you there and took prasādam also. And he wants to take some color photographs for international coverage. I will invite him again. I think in Indonesia they're usually, they're a bit slow, so a week later they will publish.

Prabhupāda: (aside) Why do you keeping . . . (indistinct) . . . bag.

Devotee: I washed it this morning (bead bag?)

Prabhupāda: Why don't you keep two is it very scarcity? . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: You wrote a letter to me from Sydney in which you said that the printing program is very nice, but by your experience, it takes much time and money. And how will we do saṅkīrtana and do prasādam distribution and printing all at the same time? And you said: "You can think this over with a cool head, and we will discuss more when we come."

Prabhupāda: But first thing is that . . . (indistinct) . . . you are not yet so expert . . . (indistinct) . . . just like the other day wanted to speak something . . . (indistinct) . . . so at the present moment you cannot depend on your strength of understanding the language. So how we can make more . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: We can have translations from that girl's . . . (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Yes that will . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: Only the translation we have done so far, some, it seems to me, not right. Although I can't read it, I've tried so many times to print it, but I can never get it printed. And it seems that if it was a good translation . . .

Prabhupāda: Why not . . . (indistinct) . . .? Translate each verse . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: Maybe on the street. Somebody wash clothes. Their standard of cleaning is very low. We can tell, because sometimes we ask their help to clean something, "Please make this very, very clean," and they . . . and it's not clean. There are intelligent people, though, in Jakarta. They have Theosophical Society with a large following, and there's many Buddhist people who are fairly intelligent.

Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: Today is Wednesday. They meet on Thursday. I'll go see them today.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) . . . sentimentalist, speculators . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: They meet at 6 o'clock, I think, and our meeting is 7 o'clock, so maybe I should invite them, because I don't think it would be time to go there. If you would like to stay a few more days, I can arrange many more meetings. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) . . . also they do not understand.

Amogha: In the Theosophical Society?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Amogha: Yes. Not everyone, but one leader I spoke to, he understood, and he liked it very much.

Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: I will call him.

(pause)

Prabhupāda: Good ḍāl is not available here?

Amogha: Good ḍāl?

Prabhupāda: The ḍāl, it does not boil.

Amogha: It's not good. What kind of ḍāl did they offer you, to you?

Prabhupāda: . . . (indistinct)

Amogha: I'll ask Śrutakīrti. I must go and pick some flowers for the garland. (offers obeisances) Shall we go to the same place for the walk? It is too far away?

Prabhupāda: Yes. They will not allow . . . (indistinct) . . . (break) (end)